Rapture Metro Pack DLC=FAIL

[Electro-Bolt]

This DLC is a complete joke. We spent 10 dollars for 6 brand new maps that we can't even play on. I am infuriated that we're being screwed over by 2k like this (again).

I forgave 2k for the last DLC issue when we found out that the content was already on the disc. I realize that 2k's just like any other company. If it wants to make us pay a little extra for what it makes, I'm completely fine with that.

But what I won't be getting over anytime soon is the fact that I just spent 10 dollars on something that I can't even use. This is the most ridiculously idiotic mistake that I've ever seen a gaming company make.

Seriously, how much thinking does it take to realize that no one will ever be able to play on the new maps unless every single player online has bought the DLC? It seems pretty logical to me, but I might be wrong. Maybe it's a gigantically complex issue that I'm misunderstanding completely.

Unless an update comes out immediately, I'm just going to completely give up on 2k altogether. I am so sick of being disappointed like this. I might as well have burned a 10 dollar bill since I didn't get anything in return by buying the DLC. Players want to play public matches with new people and not be limited to only playing the new maps in private games.

This is what needs to happen:

Multiplayer needs to be split into two groups.

First group) Anyone can join, regardless of whether or not they bought the DLC. Maps only include the ones that were originally included with the game.

Second group) Only players who bought the DLC can choose to join. Maps only include DLC maps.

So basically, players without DLC go directly to group #1 and players with DLC can choose freely between both groups.

Does this sound like an intelligent way of organizing the multiplayer community or is it impossible because of some all too convenient technical issue in regards to how the game was made?

I think that everyone who bought this DLC today wants to know what will be done to fix this problem, so it would be greatly appreciated if a developer could address this issue.

[NoT Jaymie Timmer]

This DLC is a complete joke. We spent 10 dollars for 6 brand new maps that we can't even play on. I am infuriated that we're being screwed over by 2k like this (again).

I forgave 2k for the last DLC issue when we found out that the content was already on the disc. I realize that 2k's just like any other company. If it wants to make us pay a little extra for what it makes, I'm completely fine with that.

But what I won't be getting over anytime soon is the fact that I just spent 10 dollars on something that I can't even use. This is the most ridiculously idiotic mistake that I've ever seen a gaming company make.

Seriously, how much thinking does it take to realize that no one will ever be able to play on the new maps unless every single player online has bought the DLC? It seems pretty logical to me, but I might be wrong. Maybe it's a gigantically complex issue that I'm misunderstanding completely.

Unless an update comes out immediately, I'm just going to completely give up on 2k altogether. I am so sick of being disappointed like this. I might as well have burned a 10 dollar bill since I didn't get anything in return by buying the DLC. Players want to play public matches with new people and not be limited to only playing the new maps in private games.

This is what needs to happen:

Multiplayer needs to be split into two groups.

First group) Anyone can join, regardless of whether or not they bought the DLC. Maps only include the ones that were originally included with the game.

Second group) Only players who bought the DLC can choose to join. Maps only include DLC maps.

So basically, players without DLC go directly to group #1 and players with DLC can choose freely between both groups.

Does this sound like an intelligent way of organizing the multiplayer community or is it impossible because of some all too convenient technical issue in regards to how the game was made?

I think that everyone who bought this DLC today wants to know what will be done to fix this problem, so it would be greatly appreciated if a developer could address this issue.

can't agree more i've played the new maps exatly 0 times and ive been playing since 12 a grand total of 6 hours

[Magic17]

agree!...i can't even play a private match unless i'm on my own...

[Electro-Bolt]

can't agree more i've played the new maps exatly 0 times and ive been playing since 12 a grand total of 6 hours

You have more patience than I do. I gave up after 4 hours of false hope.

[magicman4443]

Actually, the first two matches I played after buying it were on new Maps. I've played Pauper's Drop, and Fontaine Fisheries.

[iPomegranate]

Actually, the first two matches I played after buying it were on new Maps. I've played Pauper's Drop, and Fontaine Fisheries.

I've played on Fisheries and...

D. Park ^_^ Aren't I lucky?!

[Relight]

This is certainly the most important question to be asking in my opinion, although I want to mention that there are a large number of other questions that need to be addressed as well.

The fact that it's release day for the DLC and no representative of 2K is active on these forums to help answer questions is very sad, and indicative of the trend of decreasing support the BioShock community has been receiving since the day BioShock 2 was released.

[Tom2020]

This is certainly the most important question to be asking in my opinion, although I want to mention that there are a large number of other questions that need to be addressed as well.

The fact that it's release day for the DLC and no representative of 2K is active on these forums to help answer questions is very sad, and indicative of the trend of decreasing support the BioShock community has been receiving since the day BioShock 2 was released.

Just further proves that 2K is not different than EA....

[Rybow73]

Luckily, I have a lot of private matches...and a lot of my online friends are getting the DLC as well...so I'll be able to play the maps frequently.

[RhinoOfficial]

There NEEDS to be a seperat mode for people with the map pack like CoD...

[Althea N Hell]

I don't have any illusions that i will be playing on the new maps anytime soon so I'm just enjoying playing with the noobs in Rebirth right now.

Of all the things we could have anticipated about the DLC, I don't think ANY of us could have predicted we wouldn't even be able to play on the new maps today. It's too ridiculous to even have crossed our minds!

[Codex]

Hey, so, anyone remember the Halo multiplayer maps that you can only access if everyone has the DLC? I've experianced those infuriating beasties more than once.

The fact of the matter is that the BS2 Multiplayer is a much smaller user base. You will have to wait a day or two until the majority of people have the DLC to play the maps. Until then, you're just going to have to use the old maps, or get a group of people together from the forums who have the DLC together and play some private matches. You won't get the ADAM, but that only matters if you're a leaderboards obsessed person, doesn't it?

[iPomegranate]

Why does the Codex have such wisdom?

*Raises her mighty gold and diamond pitchfork for her to claim*

[Codex]

Why does the Codex have such wisdom?

*Raises her mighty gold and diamond pitchfork for her to claim*

*takes it, and strikes a pose*

I don't have wisdom, I just can take a step back and objectively look at the issue

But returning to my Halo analogy, the multiplayer player base for BS2 is minuscule (I'm guessing, unless someone can show me some numbers to contradict me). Say only 10% of those people have the DLC today (given that school on the west coast here has only been out for one hour, its quite plausible), so there is only 10% of the playerbase with whom to have a game with. Its very unlikely that if you've undergone rebirth and started back at the beginning with other new players that they don't have the DLC yet. It's going to take a few weeks. Try and get some private matches going, that way you can at least play some of the new maps.

[Electro-Bolt]

You will have to wait a day or two until the majority of people have the DLC to play the maps.

That's an interesting way to look at it, but I disagree. Even if a single player doesn't have the DLC, whichever lobby he's in won't be able to play the new maps and since there's no way to kick people, that one person will ruin everything for the other 9 players.

Most people that play Bioshock 2 online aren't as obsessed with it as we are, so I doubt that they'll buy the DLC. Not to mention that $10.00 is a bit pricey. I'm predicting that less than 50% of the current players will have the DLC by the end of the month.

But you know, I'm staying optimistic. If 2k doesn't fix this problem, I'm sure that in a year or two only the serious players will still be playing the game online and they'll most likely have the DLC, that way, we'll finally be able to play public online matches.

[Codex]

That's an interesting way to look at it, but I disagree. Even if a single player doesn't have the DLC, whichever lobby he's in won't be able to play the new maps and since there's no way to kick people, that one person will ruin everything for the other 9 players.

Most people that play Bioshock 2 online aren't as obsessed with it as we are, so I doubt that they'll buy the DLC. Not to mention that $10.00 is a bit pricey. I don't even expect 50% of all online players to get the DLC.

But you know, I'm staying optimistic. If 2k doesn't fix this problem, I'm sure that in a year or two only the serious players will still be playing the game online and they'll most likely have the DLC.

... So, you want people to be cut off entirely from playing with say, 50% of the user base simply because they don't have the DLC? I'd rather play on a few maps that I've been on before than have to wait twice as long to find a match.

[Kyburz]

Sorry Codex, I really have to agree with Electro-Bolt and Relight on this one. It really seems like such a bizarre mistake to make, I still find it hard to believe that it is actually true. The mathematics of actually being able to get into one of the new maps is infinitesimally small. In a game with a dozen people, what are the odds that every last person has the DLC? If even one person lacks it, there is no chance of seeing a new map. And even then, the chances are less than 50% that you will see a new map since there are ten regular maps and six new maps.

It strikes me as a really weird design choice. I figure 2k would want to get players back playing the multiplayer with these new maps, not force them to make all sorts of crazy arrangements to try to be online at the same time as the people who has it.

[Codex]

Sorry Codex, I really have to agree with Electro-Bolt and Relight on this one. It really seems like such a bizarre mistake to make, I still find it hard to believe that it is actually true. The mathematics of actually being able to get into one of the new maps is infinitesimally small. In a game with a dozen people, what are the odds that every last person has the DLC? If even one person lacks it, there is no chance of seeing a new map. And even then, the chances are less than 50% that you will see a new map since there are ten regular maps and six new maps.

It strikes me as a really weird design choice. I figure 2k would want to get players back playing the multiplayer with these new maps, not force them to make all sorts of crazy arrangements to try to be online at the same time as the people who has it.

But it is the exact same design choice as Halo. Sorry, 2k is not hte first to do things this way. The problem is in the size of the user base.

[the silent voice]

i was sooo excited for the dlc , after reading the impressions of u guys , i dont think that i will buy it ! , so 2k are saying :
(hey fans , we dont give a **** about you , complain as much as u like whether about the lag , the crappy lobbly ,or about the impressive REBIRTH that deletes your leaderboard stats . if no one is able to play in the new maps so what ? what matters is that we will steal your money everytime we can , more crappy DLCs are on the way too )

thank god that red dead redemption is coming out next week , maybe if we ignore them for a while they might listen to us , i cant stand their ignorance anymore , they dont care about us , why do we care about their game ?

[Electro-Bolt]

... So, you want people to be cut off entirely from playing with say, 50% of the user base simply because they don't have the DLC? I'd rather play on a few maps that I've been on before than have to wait twice as long to find a match.

I already explained what I think should be done:

Multiplayer needs to be split into two groups.

First group) Anyone can join, regardless of whether or not they bought the DLC. Maps only include the ones that were originally included with the game.

Second group) Only players who bought the DLC can choose to join. Maps only include DLC maps.

So basically, players without DLC go directly to group #1 and players with DLC can choose freely between both groups.

[Codex]

I already explained what I think should be done:

I saw that but it still splits the player base. You're cutting off players from each other, which, in my opinion, is stupid and elitist.

[Electro-Bolt]

i was sooo excited for the dlc , after reading the impressions of u guys , i dont think that i will buy it ! , so 2k are saying :
(hey fans , we dont give a **** about you , complain as much as u like whether about the lag , the crappy lobbly ,or about the impressive REBIRTH that deletes your leaderboard stats . if no one is able to play in the new maps so what ? what matters is that we will steal your money everytime we can , more crappy DLCs are on the way too )

That's not what I said at all...

A patch came out today to fix the lagging and the Rebirth feature is really cool. The problem is that the DLC wasn't thought out at all. We can't play on the new maps publicly because most people online haven't bought the DLC.

[Kyburz]

But it is the exact same design choice as Halo. Sorry, 2k is not hte first to do things this way. The problem is in the size of the user base.

I've never played Halo, but I know Gears of War always had a playlist system where you could play the new maps, from these comments it sounds like Call of Duty does too. I would think the size of the userbase would be an incentive to get these new maps up front and center to bring people back to the multiplayer and get them to explore the some of the other new options like Rebirth and maybe even lure them into some of the other DLCs like the Bioshock 2 Character pack or the Sinclair Solutions Tester Pack.

[Electro-Bolt]

I saw that but it still splits the player base. You're cutting off players from each other, which, in my opinion, is stupid and elitist.

It's stupid to give people who bought extra maps the choice to play with other people who also have the maps? I don't see where you're getting at. People who have the DLC would still be able to play with people who don't have the DLC.

It works perfectly because it doesn't force players to be separated from other players. It gives them a choice, and frankly, that the least that could be done and it's the best way to fix this issue.

But you know, we can always just hope that every online player buys the DLC.

[Systemaddict]

It's stupid to give people who bought extra maps the choice to play with other people who also have the maps? I don't see where you're getting at. People who have the DLC would still be able to play with people who don't have the DLC.

It works perfectly because it doesn't force players to be separated from other players. It gives them a choice, and frankly, that the least that could be done and it's the best way to fix this issue.

But you know, we can always just hope that every online player buys the DLC.

You're right.

It should be simple enough to have a mode in the lobby for gamemodes based around the new maps - so only people that have them drop in.

I think COD4 did that quite well.

After awhile people that are sticking around tend to get the DLC - but you can't expect everyone too and it's not a good move by 2K to limit people that bought it into not having a choice to play it specifically.

[Kyburz]

Yeah, if you really break down the mathematics of it, it seems like people will only play a tiny handful of games on the new maps over the course of their lifetime, if they ever get to play them at all. For even the most popular DLC, the attach rate is always below 50%. I have good reason to believe that it will be even below 25% for this particular DLC. Even below 10%, realistically. But let's be generous and say that 20% of the Bioshock 2 owners buy this, which is WAY more than will actually happen, but let's just assume that. The chances of all 12 players in a game of Civil War being part of that 20% would be like, man, I can't even calculate it. Like .2 to the 12th power and then like convert it to a percentage, bah, I suck at math, but it is a really small percentage. Even if you factor in the assumption that the demographic of players who play more often and are more likely to be in your game are statistically more likely to have the DLC, that would only change the equation a little bit. Not enough to make these new maps the kind of commonplace occurrence that people who paid for them would want to see.

[lilpippi]

What's more, the new achievements specify playing and winning during non-private matches on the new maps.

If anyone can get on them that is ...

[Kyburz]

What's more, the new achievements specify playing and winning during non-private matches on the new maps.

If anyone can get on them that is ...

Oh wow, I forgot about that.

Man, are you guys SURE there is no playlist for the new maps? I mean, there has to be right? Right?

[Codex]

I've never played CoD or Gears online. Never seen the point to do so beyond co-op.

I believe we're going to have to agree to disagree. I don't see it as a huge flaw. It will even itself out in a few days, and you just have to be patient.

[Electro-Bolt]

The chances of all 12 players in a game of Civil War being part of that 20% would be like, man, I can't even calculate it. Like .2 to the 12th power and then like convert it to a percentage, bah, I suck at math, but it is a really small percentage. Even if you factor in the assumption that the demographic of players who play more often and are more likely to be in your game are statistically more likely to have the DLC, that would only change the equation a little bit. Not enough to make these new maps the kind of commonplace occurrence that people who paid for them would want to see.

My point exactly. And don't forget that even if all 12 players do have the DLC, the random map might not even be one of the new ones from the DLC. It could be one of the original maps.

Unless this problem is solved, it will be literally impossible for every player in a lobby to have the DLC, making it unlikely that anyone will ever even get to play on one of the new maps during a public game.

[WestCoastbadger]

My point exactly. And don't forget that even if all 12 players do have the DLC, the random map might not even be one of the new ones from the DLC. It could be one of the original maps.

Unless this problem is solved, it will be literally impossible for every player in a lobby to have the DLC, making it unlikely that anyone will ever even get to play on one of the new maps during a public game.

Yep, big problem. I'm going to hold off on the DLC now.

[Kyburz]

I guess the only good thing to come out of this is that we are left with an appropriately Bioshockian social experiment.

People that buy the the new maps can't play them unless more people buy the new maps, but new people might be disclined from buying the new maps since the current owners can't play with the new maps. It is kind of a Prisoner's Dillemma type quandary. I will say, I find that properly Rapturian.

[Althea N Hell]

Just a quick statistic, there are approximately 470,000 people on the Xbox leaderboards.

I know this because when I chose to rebirth that's what my leaderboard standing became and I assume I was in last place, having accumulated 0 Adam thus far.

The strange thing is that after I played only 2 or 3 matches I ascended over a HUNDRED THOUSAND people to become number 380,000 on the boards.

I assume those are all people that played the multiplayer once or twice and decided it wasn't for them.

The strange thing is my Leaderboard stats say I'm only averaging "6" Adam per game! The reality however is that I'm netting at least 200 Adam per game on kills alone, nevermind from turrets, vending machine, match bonuses, etc. So where does this "6" average come from?

Sorry to put this useless info here but I just wanted to note that out of the 470,000 people who ever played the multiplayer on Xbox, I doubt there's even 1,000 who still do. And then you have to figure that only a fraction of that number were devoted to the game enough to purchase the DLC.

So what are the chances of getting 6 or more of those people in the SAME lobby room who all purchased the DLC? Slim to none I'd say considering how daunting it was to find a game even before the DLC came out.

[Althea N Hell]

Yep, big problem. I'm going to hold off on the DLC now.

Then you'll be missing out on having your leaderboard stats stolen from you and acquiring access to a bunch of maps you'll never actually play on! You can hold off if you'd like, but you do so at your own peril.

[the silent voice]

did they release the long waited patch ? because i ve just played a match and there was NO LAG ! but i didnt download any patch !

[TheEternalOne]

Sorry to put this useless info here but I just wanted to note that out of the 470,000 people who ever played the multiplayer on Xbox, I doubt there's even 1,000 who still do.

I would guess more in the range of 5,000 or so. They just don't all play at once.

[Relight]

Just a quick statistic, there are approximately 470,000 people on the Xbox leaderboards.

That's great info!

Look at this way, folks... no split player base

Now we're all begging 2K to split the player base!

[nbajammer]

Not only can I not get into the new maps, when I'm playing "Kill 'Em Kindly" and I swing my golf club, I am the one dropping dead, not the person I hit. And it shows the other person getting hit. Once it even said I committed suicide, and I couldn't even tell you how.

[october_midnight]

I still have my $10.

[WestCoastbadger]

Then you'll be missing out on having your leaderboard stats stolen from you and acquiring access to a bunch of maps you'll never actually play on! You can hold off if you'd like, but you do so at your own peril.

LOL! Perilous indeed!

Ironically, I couldn't care less about the leaderboard issue as I've never been interested in my "stats" or other's "stats." Especially the total ADAM stat. But, lots of you do care and should have been warned.