Theortically: can Savannah make it in the game as a terrain or terrian feature?

[Akinaba]

Basicly one more "I have what seems to me like a nice idea" thread.

So I thought eventually, of Savanna as a good candiidate for being a terrain or terrain feature that was actually never in the game.

I feel lack of kind of smooth transition between plains and Jungles, or Jungles and Forest, or Desert and Jungles. Now Jungles grows freely near the Forests and that's seem a bit not interesting to me. Also we have a Tundra terrain it would only be reasonable if we'll have Svannah's.

Should it be a terrain (so that Forests could grow upon it) or a feature on terrain? Your oppinions, thoughts and/or STFU's on this theme are all wellcomed.

[toadwheels12]

Wouldn't "Plains" kinda fall within this category to some extent?

[Ljethan]

isn't plains a sort of allaround "grassy land - few trees"? In that case, it would fit Savannah already. If you're talking about animals, then you can have elephants on plains, then it would be savannah. Overall, cannot see the big idea of making savanna a terrain option.

As for making it a terrain feature, then you would need a bonus to said feature, to justify its presence within the game world. What bonus should savannah have then that is not covered by plains already?

[Akinaba]

I also, thought about certain bonus, and I kind come out with 1 food and 1 gold, per tile, or 1 production and 1 gold, or just 1 gold.

Savannas usually grow in desert-like regions, so in this case it appears to be a feature only allowed on deserts.

And Savanna is not just a "grassy land -- few trees" it's more likely "bushy land -- few trees" the diference is that savanas are harder to pass compartively to the planes, not speaking of that it's much harder to cultivate them.

[Ljethan]

well, I guess it could act as a feature, if the conditions are light - like, only appea on desert tiles that boarders a plane or grass tile. Still, cant really see the overall idea of this, except adding another feature to the desert, which is meant to be desolant.

[Akinaba]

First of all should keep in mind that when we build some certain improvements we remove some features.

If to determine conditions of where it should appear I'll define desert, planes and hills. But only close to tiles with desert, grass, jungles or forest.

Now the reason -- it's simple improoving the desert tiles to be more profitable and contributing, to make deserts more comfortable to settle cities, and making the Civ world closer to the real one at the same time.

If it'll add 1 food and 1 gold to the terrain then, together with the plains (1 food and 1 production) we have 2 food, 1 production and 1 gold per tile, what allready good in the beginning of the game. Then you obviously remoove this feaure if you construct Farm, Mine, or Traiding Post. However, Pasture, and Camps, do not remoove this feature.

In the end it sounds not so exiting for me either yet, but it's always good to discuss.

[SlickSlicer]

They should add poison swamps as well.

[MadDjinn]

It's a plausible addition, but from what I remember of what modding talk I've heard, it's impossible (or very hard) to add a new terrain type or feature in Civ 5 (right now).

So the dev would have to do it.

I'd likely say it'd be a feature, not a type, similar to floodplains (design wise).

It is a 'would be nice' option though, since Savannahs would at least make some sense in game, rather than just mass desert area (thinking the earth map).

Given that they are 'mainly desert' but usually are 'flooded' for a period (major short term biomass growth supports mass herd animals), I'd likely just suggest a +1 food bonus (which means it'd be base 1 food, nothing else due to the desert base of 0). It could then be TP'd/pastured/etc without causing imbalance issues.

After that, certain luxuries could be shifted to be on that type, rather than plains or deserts.

[Akinaba]

They should add poison swamps as well.

Oh you..

[SlickSlicer]

Oh you..

I was being serious. They'd be cool! Step on them with a unit and you'd take damage. Best be avoiding them. I think they should take 1 MP to move onto to balance out the fact that they would damage units.

[Akinaba]

I was being serious. They'd be cool! Step on them with a unit and you'd take damage. Best be avoiding them...

Not sure if serious but oh well... Ok.

Given that they are 'mainly desert' but usually are 'flooded' for a period (major short term biomass growth supports mass herd animals), I'd likely just suggest a +1 food bonus (which means it'd be base 1 food, nothing else due to the desert base of 0). It could then be TP'd/pastured/etc without causing imbalance issues.

After that, certain luxuries could be shifted to be on that type, rather than plains or deserts.

Well I thought of +1 food as a possible contribution to the terrain bonus as well. But I can not see how we can make a feature being Trading Posted, Pastured, or Mined without removing it. Do we have any examples of features not being remooved by this three improvements?

It'll also make Savanna very similar to the Tundra tiles, so it turns me to think of it as a terrain back again. Need to talk this around.

[MadDjinn]

Well I thought of +1 food as a possible contribution to the terrain bonus, but I can not see how we can make a feature being Trading Posted, Pastured, or Mined. Do we have any examples of features not being remooved by this three improvements?

flood plains, hills, marshes, trees, jungles (last two TP only). Though, marshes are removable along with trees/jungles.

basically, other than trees/jungles, nothing gets removed when the hex is removed, so you always gain when they are improved.

[Akinaba]

Oh, just came to mind in addition that we could have a bonus resource, that spawns on desert tiles (particulary in savannahs). First that come to mind is an Anthelope (or Kudu) or Bubalus (Buffalos) (since thet is more general, and refers not only to Africa but to also to Asia), that will provide obviously +1 production when improoved by camp and/or cattle. (Will perfectly fit the African continent. Yay! ). We have Deers, why shouldn't we have Anthelopes?

[Hawk]

It doesn't seem all that important, however it would be nice visually - and maybe strategically as well to a small extent - to have more terrain types with more varying bonuses. I'd vote in favour of it, but as I said, not all that important. (At least one more terrain type would be nice at any rate)

[Joketa]

The only reason I can think of to add savanna would be so that they could apply it to tropical areas and have elephants spawn only on savanna. I find it strange to see elephants hanging around the tundra.

[Hawk]

The only reason I can think of to add savanna would be so that they could apply it to tropical areas and have elephants spawn only on savanna. I find it strange to see elephants hanging around the tundra.

A good point, although elephants are found in jungles, and even in deserts. More than that reason you have to admit that visually it'd be nice as well.

[Joketa]

Yes, elephants are found in jungles, but not in this game so far. It would actually be cool to have them in jungles to get some production out of jungles without destroying them, but that's another topic. Savanna would look cool. I'll give you that. I think it'd be good to restrict elephants to the tropics in some way.

[Hawk]

Yes, elephants are found in jungles, but not in this game so far. It would actually be cool to have them in jungles to get some production out of jungles without destroying them, but that's another topic. Savanna would look cool. I'll give you that. I think it'd be good to restrict elephants to the tropics in some way.

This thread has given me an idea...

Add savannah tiles, allow elephants to be on jungle tiles, and restrict elephants to those two tile types...What d'ye guys think?

[Gedemo]

We had a suggestion about a mangrove terrain type that can had a bonus on coastal type or , on the contrary, that can have restricted movement...

[Hawk]

Yes, I remember that. Mangrove tiles would be cool as well if the developers are up to it, although savannah might be a little more appreciated. A good portion of the outback of Australia is savannah, and Africa is very well known for its savannah landscapes.

[tfordp]

isn't plains a sort of allaround "grassy land - few trees"? In that case, it would fit Savannah already. If you're talking about animals, then you can have elephants on plains, then it would be savannah. Overall, cannot see the big idea of making savanna a terrain option.

This ^^

10Char

[chrisjwmartin]

I find it strange to see elephants hanging around the tundra.

I think of them as woolly mammoths.

[VicRatlhead51]

Adding Savannah when plains and grassland are already in seems redundant.

[Black Gate of Mordor]

To answer the OP's question:

Yes. Theoretically, savannah can make it into the game.

However, I don't think this was your desired effect. I believe you may be asking the developers whether or not they will include this feature. This answer is far more murky.

[Akinaba]

However, I don't think this was your desired effect. I believe you may be asking the developers whether or not they will include this feature. This answer is far more murky.

Actually I wanted to ask forum members for their oppinion on the subject -- its the first, and to just throw an idea (what seemd to be not absolute horsecrap as usual) out so to share. That was the expected effect.

And I'm not feel so naiive to ask devs to include certain fetures to the game, I believe they know it better by themselves.

[zephyrtr]

Soil can have lots of characteristics. Obviously 'Grassland' is the brown-gray soil that made Europe so successful agriculturally. 'Plains' is I guess rockier terrains, like those in Scotland. A red clay tile would be real neat, but seems kinda farfetched. What yield would it give? You'd have to radically alter some of the game's fundamentals to make room for it, or starting on red clay would be an instant game over.

[Akinaba]

I'd agree with MadJinn and gave it +1 food.