Man, if theres one thing I wish its that there was some secret level/ way to enter that locked apartment!!! I tried everything to no avail but if Bioshock was an MMO(RPG), I would be ridiculously happy.Originally Posted by watchman
Rapture. Is. Big.
Endless potential for living space/ factions/ missions/ weapons/ battles/ and so forth. From a multiplayer perspective, Rapture and Columbia are great places for lot's of people to play with.
In the MMORPG thread (that big wall of text) I mentioned an advanced feature of having Players add content (a BIG difficult feature to implement for any game company), IT would be capable of filling that Big space (versus so many MMORGs with big worlds but so little really in them gameswise.)
But this MP thread just reminded me that there ARE alot of people who want the PvP element (walled off adaquately so not to disrupt those who dont care for it in other parts of the game). No matter how good the NPCs are, they just never really do a proper job with tactics (beyond very limited well choreographed scenes) and players can be very creative (and a bother to developers who have to keep closing off loopholes or rebalancing things)
Large numbers of very active PvP players in a small space might require a bit better serverside systems but assume a few more years before this thing could exist (though the lag will be a problem for a long time - the network infrastructure just doesnt improve that fast).
Columbia I suppose has the same potential (just not so easy to have additions justified when the extended city is not obscured by dark ocean murk). But having BOTH available in Parallel as MMORPG - since results of developing the modular game engine/ clientside/ player tools... could largely be shared --- and even many assets could be used in common (which was one of the sales points I tried to mention that might take alot of the sting out of the up-front costs needed to make it happen -- all the additional MMORPG games that the same system could be used for.).
Ive used the cheats (fly and ghost) to 'look behind the scenes' in both BS1 and BS2 and unfortunately that kind of unreachable door IS all that is really there (sometimes there a dummy room behind it if the door is part of an already developed structure 'unit' they borrowed from someplace else.)
Im my 'dream' MMORPG there would be no 'doors with nothing behind them' and if all else failed you could dig thru the wall to find whatever should be there (and maybe drown because you dug out into the ocean). In this case, there would be some similar apartment behind it, but either deserted or wrecked (or soon to be wrecked when you used it to 'test' your loadouts....)
YES I WANT MP!!!
the MP wil be awesome since using plasmids with weapons is unique for any MP
but I do hope they fix some litle issues wich where in BS2 MP:
-no reserection tonic or at least a better nerved rez tonic, the rezerection tonic in bs2 had so much errors;
people could use grenade launcher while reserecting meaning they could kill them self (cuicide) providing nobody the kill
- TK is way overpowered, the fact that the hitted enemy cant do a thing for 2 seconds and even 4 if hitted and also a damge of 20% is just rediculous overpowered. let it stun for 2 second but let plasmids like Airo Dash stil be useble
- Elektrobolt provided a to easy way to headshot, if there is going to be a elektro bolt let the hitted enemy shake there head like crazy(logical reaction to electricity) to make headshots even with Elektrobolt a challenge
-further more the match making needs to be inproved, to many times Ive seen noobs (lv 1-10) face 4 level 50's , this could easely be solved by making a level 1-20 room only
-if new maps plz make a play list for them
I ques thats all, Im looking forward to the bioshock infinite MP
PS: I do hope there wil be more then just coop I wanna kill people online
I honestly don't want multiplayer in Infinite because I would rather have the game focus on establishing Columbia's story and campaign more then divide the game to give some attention to a multiplayer.
Besides, Bioshock 1 didn't have multiplayer so I doubt Infinite will have it too.
I honestly don't want multiplayer in Infinite because I would rather have the game focus on establishing Columbia's story and campaign more then divide the game to give some attention to a multiplayer.
Besides, Bioshock 1 didn't have multiplayer so I doubt Infinite will have it too.
Of course you assume there would be a second Infinite.
Not sure how they would work it for some real epic ending to Columbia/Elizabeth situation where its really made 'to be continued' ...
I suppose it could crash and 20 years later the 'evil' ruins are now being searched by Nazis....
Or crashes somewhere in America and causes what was known as the Dust Bowl. That's always an option
Sorry for being off topic everyone.
Or crashes somewhere in America and causes what was known as the Dust Bowl. That's always an option
Sorry for being off topic everyone.
Or goes thru a 'tear' back to 1908 Siberia, crashes and causes the 'Tunguska event" ....
Anything is possible when magic starts taking over the game.
Wasnt Andrew Ryan supposed to be born around 1912 ????? (hmmmm....)
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Anyway MP .... there are a chunk of players who would buy the game if it had MP and that has to be weighed against how much it will cost to produce it (and it better not be DLC or it will fail to get sufficient players)
I say nay, Co-op maybe. See they added multiplayer in BS2, but it was completely unnecessary and not what I expected, the part of the online that I loved was the game mode where you fight over the little sisters.
Same Modding Solo+MP idea as in the below link - except do it for Infinite
Sold as a seperate product but with more going for it than just 'MP'
Maybe as a combined project with the next Solo Infinite game (if there ever is one) and use the Mod tools as part of their development.
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http://forums.2kgames.com/showthread...58#post1600458
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I wanna say yeah but imo multiplayer has ruined gaming "to an extent" and its more important to focus on the SP experience when it comes to Bioshock, just my opinion.
Imagine what trouble you would have in the Solo game if the Splicers were as tricky as Players are in the MP.
Let them be able to set traps or throw exploding barrels at you (besides running about like maniacs) and it would be an entirely different experience.
Would have to be 'Realistic' mode - just because Splicers are insane doesnt mean they arent tricky.
Lets see if Infinite will just be the 'you do less damage and they do more' method if increasing 'difficulty'.
Last edited by watchman; 06-24-2012 at 02:37 AM.
I found them largely pandering to the crack-monkey mentality, with games touting themselves as 'realistic' having the MP reduced to absurd gimmickry and cartoon action. Seriously, some of them have players moving 4X faster than anything real and over an internet connection it only makes the latency/lag problem much worse. The designers of that kind of trash are imbiciles.
I feel that if infinite would have a mp it would be awesome. I mean who wouldn't want to play with different plasmids against your friends? Who say's they have to keep the same old plasmids and tonics that they had in BS2 I say bring on the new plasmidsHell while their at why not throw in some new weapons too
If they do include MP, they sure as hell better do a better job of balancing plasmids than BS2 and I'd hope they'd keep is story-centric. If anyone here has played the Gang Wars mode in Max Payne 3's multiplayer, I think that'd be a good example of story-based MP.
For the uninitiated, the gamemode consists of objectives that change over time, which are given backstory by a disembodied narrator, often Max himself or someone talking to him. Something like that- really anything that adds story to competitive multiplayer- would be great IMO.
Infinite MP - They would largely use whatever weapons and magic potions that they have in the Infinite solo game (costs too much to not reuse what they already developed). The 'tear' bit would be harder to fit into the typical crack-monkey MP type scenarios. Its Elizabeth that actually does the 'tears' -- might be weird for EVERYONE in the MP game to have their own Elizabeth in tow - would need her to be largely invulnerable or other players could waste her(them) way to easy.I feel that if infinite would have a mp it would be awesome. I mean who wouldn't want to play with different plasmids against your friends? Who say's they have to keep the same old plasmids and tonics that they had in BS2 I say bring on the new plasmids
The 3D map with the ziplines would be the biggest difference.
How big was the map in that type of MP (with the changing targets steering the players to areas) when most MP type games have to have fairly small circular maps so that the players dont get too spread out/hard to find (or respawn too far from the action).
NO, UNLESS its like Co-op stuff, like Spec-Ops, and open -world lobbies like in Red Dead Redemption/GTA4/Arma 2, that could be fun. I say nay if online contains any PVP.
Still waiting for Red Dead Redemption for the PC...
GTA4 multiplayer?? hmm I guess their simple mission mechanism could work just as well for more than one player taking part.
Having PVP (as optional) might allow enough intrest (sales) to make them consider developing it. On the other hand it might stear it into the same junk most other PVP add-ons turn into.
Now that I think about it, I feel like people are getting mad at the word MULTIPLAYER because of what its been tacked onto in past games.
After playing games like the Demon/Dark Souls series and seeing others with interesting online aspects, I think the whole TEAR aspect of Bioshock Infinite could lead to some interesting multiplayer ideas INSIDE the single player game.
I used to be in the NOMULTIPLAYER camp, but i gotta say, maybe running into other players during single player through specificly enhanced TEARS sounds interesting.
Not sure how they would do this quick/sudden linking up your computer with someone elses. Look at the delays you get with any lobby based MP game. They (company) also probably wouldnt want to run any servers to support it.
Also You may only have 'tears' active less than 5% of the playing time (and alot of them are simple modifications to the players game situation and not appropriate to adding a temporary player into the game situation) and you would have to be matched up to someone else in the middle of a tear starting (and then you get pulled to their game or them to yours or whatever...).
If it has to be the same level (or have a LOOONG terrain load) then that makes the probability of someone else ready to join you even less.
Anything like this, they better make sure that whoever you are matched up with in a tear cant grief you in any way (you KNOW there will be people reloading a tear save point again and again hoping to get a chance to screw someone else over if they are allowed to )
One BIG negative to any MP is that it will require all the login/validation stuff (and delays and 'store' bother) that is one more set of things to be buggy.
With all of that I would rather want a true MP continuous co-op type game, with all players able to see/be involved in whatever tears happen (with usual problem of forcing the MPs to be in the same place and not wander too far away from the tears that are usually choreographed to be seen from one point)
Last edited by watchman; 07-06-2012 at 06:59 AM.
Once again, you seem to assume the norm for multiplayer functionality.
Have you ever played dark souls or demon souls?
The validation and authentication for connecting to another player is based on whether you are signed on to Playstation Network or Xbox Live.
it uses a Peer 2 peer based connection system where, if you are signed on to PSN/XBL/ or such, a client can randomly INVADE your single player game based on whether you are in an area of the large open world map that is open to connection with other players.
You don't have to be involved with the online player base if you aren't connected.
It does not have to be instantaneous, as that's not how the architecture works in this type of multiplayer.
They also have another false-save with griefers and such by allowing a certain requirement to be filled before you can be invaded by other players. In dark souls, you have to use a consumable called humanity to be able to
have any interaction with the online player base.
If you don't become human, which is temporary based on your will to survive, you wont have any online interactions at all.
And i feel "griefing" is a wrong term. The way I see it, invaders are more like obstacles that add to the chaotic shifting of events the game might bring, and stress you to constantly prepare for unique experiences and challenges a human player brings to the table.
AND ontop of that, like dark souls, not all spontaneous online interactions have to be negative, such as PvP. The invasion aspect also had a co-op side to it, where you could be summoned through a sign on the ground to someone else's world (single-player game) to help a player overcome a challenge in the game such as a boss or level.
I feel like this type of multiplayer is a very fresh platform, and an interesting one at that. The setting and such in Bioshock Infinite works very well with the game,it seems, and they wouldn't (and shouldn't) have to just rip the system from the "Souls" games or other games with similar platforms, but could throw their own spin on the hybrid online singleplayer experience.
"griefing" is a wrong term."
When I said 'griefing' I meant what that term refers to.
The kind of troublemaker players who play loopholes that allow them to disrupt the other players game (usually with rediculous advantage and little effort) intentionally.
And as I said, they (the game company/designers/programmers) have to be very careful to deny that to all of the 14-year old mentality/mental deficients who get some kind of ego trip out of that kind of behavior.
As for Infinite, I think they would have to completely redesign the game because it is designed around the pairing of booker and elizabeth with alot of heavily choreographed situations (particularly the 'tears') that might not work at all with somone else wandering around in the scene.
Last edited by watchman; 07-09-2012 at 07:25 PM.
A cooperative Multiplayer Infinite might be something different. It would have to work just as well if there was only one player. You cannot rely on the same players being online regularly. Seeing the trailers I wonder how you would keep players together with the Ziplines taking each player in a different directions.
So you say no - but you love the capture the flag (sister) mode...which is competitive multiplayer
Definitely no. They must focus on the single player.
Yes it would be nice to try it out. It's still soon for that step, but it could well settle the argument about the fact that Bioshock is one-man game.
A problem with a more exciting 3D map/maneuverbility (versus the usual largely 2D levels) can be that it takes you far longer to figure out who/where you are being shot from. Now chasing and dodging thru more complex scenery might be good, but most MPs are just people running about like maniacs and you are just as likely to run into players around every blind corner or be shot in the back anywhere you stand. Dont really want it like MW3's idiotic MP where they can run around behind you so fast (and insta-death you) that you dont even know who killed you (or even had a chance to react). They really need to consider the latency/lag effects that aught to be well understood by now.
Maybe if they made the ziplines hard to use (you fall to your death very easy...). But that would have too many players whining how useless they are.
I feel the Bioshock Infinite should be multiplayer. They just need to include all the plasmids in the multiplayer. I personally feel that the lack of plasmids in Bioshock 2 multiplayer, was the thing that made it boring. There were a boat load of plasmids in the campaign that could not be used in multiplayer. I really wanted to use the cyclone trap and the upgraded killer bees plasmid. Another thing that Infinite multiplayer should have, are more creative multiplayer matches.
We don't deal with plasmids, but vigours and tonics, got it? Thought everyone figured this about now. People need to stop wanting an evolved version of the multi of BS2, which wouldn't be interresting in the least. They need to build it from scratch and I'm confident they'll find a satisfying recipe if there's a multi ever implemented.
I'm aware there are no plasmids. I had forgot the name of it. And second, if they don't evolve the multiplayer, then the game won't do well. Multiplayer is what people want the most. The campaign is decent, but once you beat the campaign you will want to test your skills against other people. They have to find some innovative way to evolve the multiplayer. Might be a bit difficult, since the game takes place before Bio 1 and 2, but they have to find some way to do it. If they don't, the game won't last long. That might put a high demand on Bio 3.
Splicers invade Columbia (Frankensteins Horde - at least the genre would be better)
Unfortunately alot of the MP these days is devolution of the base games. The Columbia version would be the same dim 'run around like maniacs, shooting everything in sight' with just a little more 3D-ish terrain. The solo game is built around heavily choreographed situations that just dont work for MP. Heavy (proper) cooperative would be too hard for them to script (gets too general/variable when you cant count on N players all standing on the 'X' for machinima play scenes most of these games rely on.)
Modding support ... but thats a whole area they would have to develop - tools that players can actually use.
There are plenty of things they could have done to increase replayability, but I doubt theyve done them.
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I'm afraid you haven't read any of what has been said about the game from 2010 whether it be on this here forum or in the net press. Infinite doesn't belong to the same chronology as Bio 1 and 2. We're in a dystopian 1912 world with a utopian floating city so far but there's no confirmed link that we'll get to see a young Ryan or Suchong. Ken Levine made it very clear unless they change their mind midcourse.
Oh and if you liked past bioshock games, you'll know you'll only expect a good solid solo experience with an excellent storyline, nothing more, mind you. I'm confident they'll make a long game that gives you the urge you wanna start again to experience things differently.
Oh and Bioshock 3 isn't happening. IG is done with Rapture, they declared they told the storyline they wanted at the time. 2K just ordered a second episode to build on the success of the first.
*Note to the mods: Please erase*
Last edited by losstarot; 08-05-2012 at 12:12 PM.
No offense man but I'm afraid you haven't read any of what has been said about the game from 2010 whether it be on this here forum or in the net press. Infinite doesn't belong to the same chronology as Bio 1 and 2. We're in a dystopian 1912 world with a utopian floating city so far but there's no confirmed link that we'll get to see a young Ryan or Suchong. Ken Levine made it very clear unless they change their mind midcourse.
Oh and if you liked past bioshock games, you'll know you'll only expect a good solid solo experience with an excellent storyline, nothing more, mind you. I'm confident they'll make a long game that gives you the urge you wanna start again to experience things differently.
Oh and Bioshock 3 isn't happening. IG is done with Rapture, they declared they told the storyline they wanted at the time. 2K just ordered a second episode to build on the success of the first.
'They declared' ... There is this thing called 'changing their minds' ....
Its up to them if they want to milk it some more -- a matter of if they can make more money than doing otherwise.
And it dont have to be IG, as 2K or whoever can get someone else to make it (if and when)
Fat lady hasnt sung yet.... Nothing is set in stone.
A sad thought - take BS2 MP, put tophats on all the avatars, change a few texture to match infinites turn-o-century look, put some fake ziplines into the level maps, add some balloons and sunlight, rename the plasmids to be nostrums and whatever -- VOILĄ - Infinite MP on a shoestring - make it cheapo DLC to match its cheapo production cost.
IG don't seem like the people to put in multiplayer. From the recent kotaku article it seems that if there will be any kind of multiplayer, it will be because it will make the game better. No tacked on and unoriginal MP.
YES PLZ MAKE MP!
but also prevent cuiciders and make it lag les and most inportant of al ad host imigration!
Its unbelieveble stupid that you lose al your points and get kicked out when the host decides to leave.
so MP YES, Host Imigration YES and Cuiciders NO
How about(if any competitive multiplayer at all) proper dedicated servers?
I'm just going to throw this out there unless there are many different directions you can go with the story in the sp having no mp isn't necessarily going to help the replay value.
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