@ Greg or developers: Small Changes with big impact

[OidaFuchs]

I am playing civ 5 mp with my friends since release and we are enjoying it so far.

Especially the last patch fixed a lot of mp problems and increased the performance and the stability a lot.

Thx for the developers for this.

On the other hand there are a lot of things which I think (I am a software engineer too) would be easy to implement and will hopefully be implemented in the upcoming patch.

We mostly play team games, 3on3 usually, and our biggest problems are caused by simultaneous turns.

It is very frustrating to play 3 hours to finally lose the game because of war ending in a clickfest.

While a turn based option won’t be that easy to implement things like the option to disable the ability to heal your unit after promotion would be just a single “if-else statement”.

Independent on the fact that it is very unrealistic to heal your unit while war, it makes simultaneous turns even worse.

The guy with the faster pc and connection has the big advantage to move first and additionally can heal his units, while the other one is looking at his unit getting killed before being able to promote it.

On the other side you are planning to implement animations which I think is a lot more difficult than turn based multiplayer, particular to implement animations in a non-turn based game properly.

A turn based game may increase the time a bit, especially at the beginning, but when playing a 2on2 or 3on3 I think it will be compensated with faster fighting.

And in the end it doesn’t matter if you play 5 or 6 hours, but playing 5 hours and losing the game caused by the side effects of simultaneous turns is very frustrating.

A perfect solution may be simultaneous turns while peace and a turn based game while war.

Looking forward to some feedback from Greg or the developers.

[oblio]

Looking forward to some feedback from Greg or the developers.

Lots of good ideas but don't hold your breath waiting for any official kind of a response. Its likely the next patch is already well into testing as would be G&K so anything they are going to do for sp or mp is already buttoned up.

[Artifex]

Common opinions on this board, and I have not heard a response yet.
I wish you luck.

[civdiss]

There has been talk about this since sep 2010 when I joined the forums but still no definite answer or to be more specific we got mostly negative responses in the sense that this is too difficult to implement. I hope I'm wrong but I don't think turn-based MP is coming with the next patch or XP.

[SlickSlicer]

Gosh, I agree with you so much OP. I never understood the merit behind simultaneous turns. It changes the whole game. I feel like multiplayer should be a mirror of how singleplayer works, except with players pulling the strings instead of the AI. Instead, the MP feels totally ruined by the stupid simultaneous turns, which result in enormous imbalance and affect the way military units work. It makes the whole thing feel like a really really ☺☺☺☺ty RTS instead of a turn-based game.

[lietkynes]

We mostly play team games, 3on3 usually, and our biggest problems are caused by simultaneous turns.

Heh, I (and many others) have been asking for turn based multiplayer since release.
Never got an answer.

Pitboss is being developed and I guess it will have non-simultaneous-turns option but it's "many many months" from being ready.

[porky]

I think I'm one of the few people on here that actually like the simultaneous turns, even tho I have gotten frustrated many many times while playing my friend and just sitting there watching all of my units die while I try to click on them and attack. He usually hosts our games so I assume that is why his response time seems to be faster. (I think my new computer has pretty much solved this problem for the most part tho.) However I will say that a truly one player at a time, turn based option is not an option at all for me. I just would not play that at all. That will lead to his army attacking my army for a whole turn while I can't do squat about it. The ONLY option I have at that time is to sit and watch all my units get destroyed 1 by 1. At least the way it is set up now I have a CHANCE of retreating with my units or attacking back. Make it a 1 person per turn environment and you'll see your whole army wiped out before it even says "GO!" and whoever is player #1 would have a huge advantage IMHO.

A couple other points that MIGHT help with some of your other thoughts. I thought I recalled health numbers will be raised from 10 to 100 with the upcoming patch/expansion. Don't know if that will give players more rounds to attack with said unit but it might?? Also, thought I read somewhere that the "Full Heal" upgrade will be tweaked to be more of a "Half Heal" type of thing. I hope I am correct on thinking I saw that somewhere, and it actually is factual, as I feel that would be a tremendous help at times.

I don't have a problem with them adding in individual turns in the future as long as they are completely optional.

[OidaFuchs]

Lots of good ideas but don't hold your breath waiting for any official kind of a response.

Well maybe Greg will surprise us

As for turn based perhaps they have to do it to get multiplayer animations working proberbly. I can hardly believe that they will work with simultaneous turns unless they improve the net code dramatically.

But if they can't bring a turn based option in the next patch I am still hoping for small changes like an option for disabling instant healing on promotion.

[SamBC]

I don't see why turn-based internet MP would be so hard - it's basically just hotseat but across multiple machines.

[SlickSlicer]

Well maybe Greg will surprise us

As for turn based perhaps they have to do it to get multiplayer animations working proberbly. I can hardly believe that they will work with simultaneous turns unless they improve the net code dramatically.

But if they can't bring a turn based option in the next patch I am still hoping for small changes like an option for disabling instant healing on promotion.

I thought I heard that they're nerfing the insta heal to 50%. I don't think that this solves the greater strategy dilemma posed by simultaneous turns, however.

[Artifex]

I cant speak to the new system we haven't seen yet. That could work, but it still seems to have the same underlying issue even if it is reduced.

I know this has been said before, but since we are refisiting... All that would be required to fix insta-heal as it is currently implemented would be to have it use up any remaining movement the unit has.

Simple, effective, and does not remove insta-heal as a viable use of a promotion. You would still use it to save a unit's life. Only the suprise attack is gone.

[lietkynes]

Imho insta-heal should be removed altogether.

[tfordp]

Imho insta-heal should be removed altogether.

I've thought that for a while, but yesterday it happened to save my whole game. I wouldn't want it to be further implemented as it is now, though.
I like the idea of a half-heal that uses up a whole turn and of course it loses a real promotion, which is much more valuable and why I only use them in times of extreme emergency anyway.
I do wish the AI would be better programmed to deal with promotions better, and not just insta-heal all the time.

[eastkitton]

Imho insta-heal should be removed altogether.

So much support for this...so many times it has been said over the past year.

[SlickSlicer]

I think nerfing it is good enough personally.