SPQR - Rise of Rome

[Kruelgor]

Something you'll start to see in the next update:

Freedmen is a great way to increase the population of your cities. There are 3 levels with I, II, and III. Each level increases food production by +5 in the city.

However, there is a price. The disease of slavery and finally freeing them reduces the loyalty and quality of your armies, and eats away at your empire.

Freedmen I discovery causes War Deity to become obsolete.
Freedmen II discovery causes Barracks and Tax Collection to become obsolete.
Freedmen III discovery causes Mint, Happiness Deity, and many other Happiness structures to become obsolete.

Additionally, each Freedmen "structure" reduces the defensive effectiveness of the capital palace and city walls by 5% in all your cities.

So you can see here where Slavery evolves into a detriment for the empire.

[Kruelgor]

The Festival Deity will give +1 Luxury resource for each improved luxury near the city.

[Kruelgor]

Version 7 is ready for download.

- Changed Grammaticus Discovery on tech tree to Conscientia (latin for knowledge).

- Added Ludus Litterarius structure. (gives culture and science)

- Added Grammaticus structure. (gives culture, science, and citizen engineer)

- Foederati Foot units now come with Woodsmen promotion to move through forest faster.

- Added Foederati Foot III unit.

- Added Foederati Horse III unit.

- Added Freedmen I "structure".

- Added Festival Deity structure.

- Added civilized Swordsmen I unit.

- Added barbarian Horsemen III unit.

[Torvald]

This most likely is caused by faulty XML code for one of the buildings in Rome. I had a similar bug several versions ago, but fixed that one. For this one you are describing I have been unable to duplicate. If you can figure out what building it might be that is causing it then let me know.

Were you choosing any of the Monarchy policies, by chance? Those policies affect the capital. The bug could be rooted there.

I was using the Republic group of Social Policies with my v4 game, and the buildings seem to have disappeared shortly after I had assigned a worker to one of the specialist spots in a Wonder. At turn 321 in my v6 game today, using the Democracy group of Social policies, Rome is still displaying all of the buildings, but I've carefully avoided assigning any workers to any specialist spots in the wonders. Hope this helps you in tracking down what caused the v4 problem.

[Torvald]

Okay, have just finished turn 321 of my v6 game, and the game keeps giving a CTD here (even after reloading), so felt it was a good time to provide some additional feedback.

This time around as the Roman (which appears to be the only civ choice right now), I founded four additional cities, plus captured and puppeted 3 city states, to effectively seized control of central & northern Italy. Gold was hard to get for awhile, but focusing on building roads instead of improvements really paid off, as it greatly increased my cash income. Noticed that building roads takes much less time than to improve a hex (like wheat, stone, furs, etc.) Unless this is definitely intended, you might want to make it take a little less time to improve hexes.

It was taking me an awfully long time to accumulate enough culture to obtain Social Policies, but I did have five (5) of my own cities, which partially explains that. NOTE: At the top of the screen, if you put your cursor on the culture stats, it displays the following, whcih seems to include a typo: "Each city you own will increase Social Policy costs by 7%!" I'm thinking the actual cost is really more than just 7%, as otherwise it wouldn't be taking me so long to advance Policy-wise.

Also, in the pop-up display in the city build menu for the Hunt Deity Temple, it says in part: "+2 gold and furs". I'm thinking this might need to be changed to "+2 gold from furs".

The cost to upgrade non-legacy units seems rather high. In Civ-5 vanilla, I'm used to gradually upgrading my units throughout the game, regardless of when they were built. It looks SPQR is sort of forcing the player to instead disband older units and build new, stronger ones in their place. This will take a little getting used to. Could you explain one more time which units qualify as being considered legacy, and when they need to be built to qualify?

Also, since I'm relatively new to this mod, does the mod really take 1,000 turns to complete a game? Also, is victory based solely on your game score, or are there other types of victory?

P.S. Is there a way to subscribe to this SPQR forum thread, and get an email notice when new posts are made?

[Kruelgor]

...and the buildings seem to have disappeared shortly after I had assigned a worker to one of the specialist spots in a Wonder.

If you can pinpoint what wonder that would be then I can fix it.

[Kruelgor]

Okay, have just finished turn 321 of my v6 game, and the game keeps giving a CTD here (even after reloading), so felt it was a good time to provide some additional feedback.

Hmm, I wonder what's causing the crash to desktop. I haven't ran into that yet with the latest version. It probably has something do with what the AI is doing. I noticed the AI has a problem with gold income so I'm going to fix that in Update 8.

This time around as the Roman (which appears to be the only civ choice right now),

You can play as any civ of your choice. Because of a bug in the game (not the mod) you will have to start a game, exit to menu, and THEN you can see and choose any civ.

Noticed that building roads takes much less time than to improve a hex (like wheat, stone, furs, etc.) Unless this is definitely intended, you might want to make it take a little less time to improve hexes.

Yes, that was intended. There's several structures and policies available to speed it up.

It was taking me an awfully long time to accumulate enough culture to obtain Social Policies, but I did have five (5) of my own cities, which partially explains that. NOTE: At the top of the screen, if you put your cursor on the culture stats, it displays the following, whcih seems to include a typo: "Each city you own will increase Social Policy costs by 7%!" I'm thinking the actual cost is really more than just 7%, as otherwise it wouldn't be taking me so long to advance Policy-wise.

Policies are intentionally designed to take a very long time to reach. In an average game, you should only complete 3 to 5 policy branches depending on how good (or bad) you are. The Policy costs will be adjusted and calibrated after I've seen what full games result in.

Also, in the pop-up display in the city build menu for the Hunt Deity Temple, it says in part: "+2 gold and furs". I'm thinking this might need to be changed to "+2 gold from furs".

Thanks. Fixed in next update.

The cost to upgrade non-legacy units seems rather high. In Civ-5 vanilla, I'm used to gradually upgrading my units throughout the game, regardless of when they were built. It looks SPQR is sort of forcing the player to instead disband older units and build new, stronger ones in their place. This will take a little getting used to. Could you explain one more time which units qualify as being considered legacy, and when they need to be built to qualify?

You'll just have to generate more money. Several methods there. The intention is not to force the player to disband veteran units, but to encourage you to focus on a strong economy so you can support the upgrading of your military.

Also, since I'm relatively new to this mod, does the mod really take 1,000 turns to complete a game? Also, is victory based solely on your game score, or are there other types of victory?

The game will end once you've wiped out every civilization, or 1000 turns.

As I told someone else earlier, the game is designed to be very challenging, not a walk in the park.

[Kruelgor]

I'm not going to release any more updates until I get to the bottom of what's causing the crash between turn 300 and 350.

[PachaMinnie]

Why No Seleucids? Just thought I would throw that out there. Why aren't they playable. Seems like they where more important than the People of Pontus, and being one of the largest empires at the time, I just thought...

[Kruelgor]

Why No Seleucids? Just thought I would throw that out there. Why aren't they playable. Seems like they where more important than the People of Pontus, and being one of the largest empires at the time, I just thought...

Good idea. I'll add them down the road.

[nigelr1812]

An observation re Hispania, which ia pratcially devoid of idigenious natives bar a few barbarians, one city state and Novo Cathago, when infact this conutry was inhabited by a fearsome group of tribes called the Iberian Celts who Carthage used as mercenaries and Rome spent a considerable time subjugating. Perhaps it needs a few more city states to replicate the challenge and allow alllies for Carthage

[nigelr1812]

At turn 492 and fighting the Allemani when 2 turns in a row the game has crashed for no apprent reason. Can't seem to progress any further

[Kruelgor]

An observation re Hispania, which ia pratcially devoid of idigenious natives bar a few barbarians, one city state and Novo Cathago, when infact this conutry was inhabited by a fearsome group of tribes called the Iberian Celts who Carthage used as mercenaries and Rome spent a considerable time subjugating. Perhaps it needs a few more city states to replicate the challenge and allow alllies for Carthage

If the crash is ever fixed, I'll introduce the Celtiberians as a playable civ in the area.

[Kruelgor]

At turn 492 and fighting the Allemani when 2 turns in a row the game has crashed for no apprent reason. Can't seem to progress any further

Right. I'm not releasing any more updates until the source of this crash is pinpointed.

[Kruelgor]

At turn 492 and fighting the Allemani when 2 turns in a row the game has crashed for no apprent reason. Can't seem to progress any further

If you have an autosave file 10 turns or so before the crash then email that saved file to kruelgor-[at]-yahoo.com. Let me know if you do because I don't check that email very often.

[nigelr1812]

emailed saved files

[nigelr1812]

apologies it's version 5

[Torvald]

I'm not going to release any more updates until I get to the bottom of what's causing the crash between turn 300 and 350.

Was playing last night as the Gauls (I finally figured out how to switch from Roman) with v7 and got a CTD at turn 331.

Focused on building a very large army with legacy units this time, had mopped up three city states, and was about to attack the Romans who had snuck in and founded a city in between two of mine.

Will email you this morning a RARed file of when the game crashed, plus one from ten turns earlier.

Cheers!

[Kruelgor]

I'm getting closer to pinpointing the source of the crash bug, thanks to the Ingame Editor mod.

The crash has nothing to do with policies, nothing to do with units, nothing to do with discoveries, and seems to have everything to do with a building. The odd thing is it doesn't crash until a few turns after the structure is built. I don't know specifically what building that is yet because I simply built all buildings in 1 turn as a quick test. I have to test it more.

I'm also noticing that it is indeed a specific building that is causing the building list to disappear within the city display, so my next objective is to pinpoint what building is causing the building list to vanish, and that could be the bug source.

[Kruelgor]

As someone mentioned earlier, a bug does seem to be linked to city building specialists, so one of the buildings seems to be corrupting the Specialists feature.

[Kruelgor]

This is going to be tough to pinpoint, because the buildings list is vanishing on every manually selected citizen specialist for any special buidling. I'm going to have to phyically remove buildings from the mod to test this further.

[whoward69]

I only have V3, but your BUILDING_SPQR_WORKSHOP defines a specialisttype with no corresponding specialistcount, so it's possible the engine is getting confused by the default count of 0

Would be a good place to start.

Edit: Another candidate to look at would be BUILDING_SPQR_HANGING_GARDEN as that defines 3 artist slots (which the game should be able to handle) but no standard building has 3 slots, so who knows if it's ever been tested above 2

[Kruelgor]

Very strange, the citizen specialist bug doesn't seem to be rooted to the Buildings XML at all. When I remove all buildings except for the Palace and the Sun Deity, and I select the city specialist from sun deity and the missing buildings bug still kicks in.

[Kruelgor]

I only have V3, but your BUILDING_SPQR_WORKSHOP defines a specialisttype with no corresponding specialistcount, so it's possible the engine is getting confused by the default count of 0

Yep, I fixed that one a while back.

[Kruelgor]

Very strange, the citizen specialist bug doesn't seem to be rooted to the Buildings XML at all. When I remove all buildings except for the Palace and the Sun Deity, and I select the city specialist from sun deity and the missing buildings bug still kicks in.

This is getting stranger. I removed all non-critical XML and only left in the units, buildings, and civs and the bug still exist.

[Kruelgor]

okay, the "no buildings listed when specialist is selected" bug goes away when I remove the units, the civilizations, and the leader traits. I tested it with the vanilla civs.

Detective work getting closer here.

[Kruelgor]

Okay, so I've nailed it down to somewhere in my XML units file. I believe something critical is being deleted when I delete all vanilla units, as it is removing the "Great People" drop within the the city view.

[Kruelgor]

Yes, it's definitely something in the units XML that is deleted that is causing the problem.

[Kruelgor]

Problem fixed. It didn't like me assigning a different name to the specialists in the units xml. I now had to make sure to call them exactly what they're called in the vanilla (i.e. UNIT_ARTIST and not UNIT_SPQR_ARTIST).

That's probably what was causing the game crash as well between turns 250 and 450.

[Kruelgor]

I'll release a new update in a couple of hours with the fix.

[Kruelgor]

I'll include the Celtiberians and Seleucids as playable civs in the next update here in a bit, as well.

[nigelr1812]

good news mate and look forward to the next version

[Bearspider]

Just played first 200 turns as roman again and seemed like the Ai dident expand as aggresivly in the newest version.

Last playtrought gaul build up much of gaul and greek settled 2 new cities in southern italy, this time guals had made no new cities at all around turn 170 and the same for gree, no idea if this is just the "chanse" when u do another playtrough or if something was changed.

[Kruelgor]

Just played first 200 turns as roman again and seemed like the Ai dident expand as aggresivly in the newest version.

Last playtrought gaul build up much of gaul and greek settled 2 new cities in southern italy, this time guals had made no new cities at all around turn 170 and the same for gree, no idea if this is just the "chanse" when u do another playtrough or if something was changed.

yeah, random seed ensures different game reults

[Kruelgor]

Going to add Lusitanians too. So 3 more civs coming.

[nigelr1812]

just been playing as greek states with version 7 and although my units are embarking and moving up to 16 hexes i don't seem to be able to reemebark most of the time, I have tried landing in diffferent places, also is it the Romans only who have legacy units as the greeks don't have any?

[MAHak]

my units are embarking and moving up to 16 hexes i don't seem to be able to reemebark most of the time, I have tried landing in diffferent places

I think i had the same problem in "the new world" scenario that came with the Spanish and Inca DLC. You have to use up most of the movement points before you can disembark.

[Kruelgor]

I now remember why I didn't include the Seleucids, because they were gobbled up by the Parthians and pretty much disintegrated by the time the Romans got to them.

I'll still add them though.

[Kruelgor]

just been playing as greek states with version 7 and although my units are embarking and moving up to 16 hexes i don't seem to be able to reemebark most of the time, I have tried landing in diffferent places, also is it the Romans only who have legacy units as the greeks don't have any?

Yeah, I forgot to change the 16 back to normal when I was fooling around. For Version 8 update, I've changed embarkment movement to 4.

All civs technically have legacy units but not if they've advanced past Warrior or Savage.

[Kruelgor]

ha. Could had released update 3 hours ago, so I wasted 3 hours trying to figure out why my three new civs wouldn't work only to remember 3 hours later that scene.xml needs to be placed on ImportVFS true.