Will my laptop work?!?

[Billybob25]

Hello,

I am thinking about purchasing Civ 5, and I was wondering whether my laptop would be able to handle it, and what settings I could achieve. Here are my specs:

Processor: Intel Core i3 - 330M
(Dual Core ~ 2.13 GHz)

RAM: 4 GB DDR3

Graphics Card: ATI Mobility Radeon 5145
(512 MB dedicated memory + up to 2 GB of shared memory)

Thanks,

Billy

[Hellogoodbye123]

I would give you a link to see if your lap top works but I'm on my cell phone lol .. if you find my thread about .. about buying this game someone gave me a link to see if of works .. its. the only thread I've made so far and he gave me the link almost bottom of first page

[Hellogoodbye123]

only thread I've made in civ 5 general discussion

[Hellogoodbye123]

http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri/

[slowtarget]

CanYouRunIt is a horribly inaccurate service for anything but the most mainstream gaming systems.

I like the idea, but the implementation is lacking. We've done comparisons in the past and it seems to make significant mistakes up to one third of the time.

I'd have to do more looking on your video card, but I'd say this puts you on the low end of requirements. I'd guess that you'll be above the minimums, but not by much. With Civ, the CPU doesn't matter so much as the video card and RAM and the moment your video card starts using shared memory, your performance is going to drop noticeably.

[Hellogoodbye123]

it worked for me :P

[the man of doom]

it say my laptop cant run it, but i run CiV on medium graphics

[slowtarget]

it worked for me :P

Yes, it works for some people, but it doesn't work for others. Some people with old Intel GMA graphics were getting told they were just fine (their video card had 2GB or memory! yay!). I was told that my video card had 7GB of memory (it actually has 512MB), but it was just barely over the minimum requirements, when it was actually over the recommended. It also said I didn't have a sound card. I think there were also reports of early hyper-threaded CPUs (the Northwood P4's?) being reported as dual core CPUs. They're not. A 3GHz P4 is not equivalent to a 2GHz Core2.

As someone who actually works with computers and builds them as a hobby... failing often is just as bad as failing all the time. CYRI fails so often that none of the reports can be trusted.

[Hellogoodbye123]

mm interesting, well you sound like you know about this, i barely found out yesterday so you should help this guy if his lap top works then :P lol

[Billybob25]

Hello,

Is there a way of me stopping the memory sharing with my graphics card? I think 512mb of dedicated memory is good enough to run Civ 5 on its own. I noticed (slowtarget) that in your System Req. FAQ, you said that the Intel HD is roughly equivalent to the minimum, and I know my card is much better than the Intel HD, through experience, so shouldn't I be albe to play lower settings with a good performance?

Thanks for helping,

Billy

[builder680]

Billy,

Memory sharing WRT graphics is typical of computers with integrated graphics. Instead of a card plugged into a slot (such as a PCI-E slot), these computers come with chips that are part of the motherboard. Big box stores and PC manufacturers call these graphics cards when they try to sell them to you (e.g., a couple of years ago I bought a "gaming" PC at Best Buy... Gateway GT 5432 w/Nvidia 6150 SE graphics... that's an onboard or "integrated" graphics chip, not a graphics card and therefore not all that great for gaming. From now on I will build any and all computers I buy), but they are not. They don't have their own dedicated hardware onboard, nor do they have their own RAM onboard. They use the RAM in your DIMM slots, which is the same RAM the rest of your computer uses. This is what is meant by "shared memory." A graphics card with a decent amount of its own onboard RAM doesn't need to share memory with the system.

In answer to your question, the way to "stop memory sharing" is simply to have an actual graphics card with its own RAM. If that is what you have, then you shouldn't have to worry. If you have integrated graphics, then it doesn't matter how much "dedicated memory" it says it has. It's sharing (and therefore taking away from other things) RAM with the rest of your system. So the question(s) become(s)... "Do you have an actual graphics card, or integrated graphics? If it's a card, what kind of graphics card do you have?"

You list the ATI Mobility Radeon 5145. If I'm not mistaken that's an integrated chip and not an actual graphics card. Therefore to stop it from sharing RAM (using shared memory), you'd have to buy an actual expansion card, provided your laptop even has the open slot for one.

EDIT: I could be mistaken about it being integrated though, because I don't know much about ATI cards and even less about laptops. If it's an actual card then please disregard my preceding paragraph.

[Billybob25]

Billy,

Memory sharing WRT graphics is typical of computers with integrated graphics. Instead of a card plugged into a slot (such as a PCI-E slot), these computers come with chips that are part of the motherboard. Big box stores and PC manufacturers call these graphics cards when they try to sell them to you (e.g., a couple of years ago I bought a "gaming" PC at Best Buy... Gateway GT 5432 w/Nvidia 6150 SE graphics... that's an onboard or "integrated" graphics chip, not a graphics card and therefore not all that great for gaming. From now on I will build any and all computers I buy), but they are not. They don't have their own dedicated hardware onboard, nor do they have their own RAM onboard. They use the RAM in your DIMM slots, which is the same RAM the rest of your computer uses. This is what is meant by "shared memory." A graphics card with a decent amount of its own onboard RAM doesn't need to share memory with the system.

In answer to your question, the way to "stop memory sharing" is simply to have an actual graphics card with its own RAM. If that is what you have, then you shouldn't have to worry. If you have integrated graphics, then it doesn't matter how much "dedicated memory" it says it has. It's sharing (and therefore taking away from other things) RAM with the rest of your system. So the question(s) become(s)... "Do you have an actual graphics card, or integrated graphics? If it's a card, what kind of graphics card do you have?"

You list the ATI Mobility Radeon 5145. If I'm not mistaken that's an integrated chip and not an actual graphics card. Therefore to stop it from sharing RAM (using shared memory), you'd have to buy an actual expansion card, provided your laptop even has the open slot for one.

EDIT: I could be mistaken about it being integrated though, because I don't know much about ATI cards and even less about laptops. If it's an actual card then please disregard my preceding paragraph.

Hello,

My graphics card is most definitely not integrated, as it is based on a previous dedicated card. I have 512mb of DEDICATED VRAM, so I am not sure why my computer thinks I need shared memory.

Just to put something into perspective, the graphics card I have is faster than a ATI Radeon 4570 but only slighty slower than an ATI Mobility Radeon HD 5470.

Hope this helps,

Billy

EDIT: If the 'Mobility' part of my graphics card is making you think it is integrated, this in fact is the way that ATI/AMD decide to tell you that this is a laptop graphics card. Nvidia do the same, by adding an M at the end of their laptop graphics cards; eg. Nvidia GeForce GT 330M.

[Horace]

I can run the game easily on an old xps 1530 (t9300 @ 2.5Ghz, 8600m GT) so I wouldnt have thought you would have any problems at all

[Hellogoodbye123]

Hello,

Is there a way of me stopping the memory sharing with my graphics card? I think 512mb of dedicated memory is good enough to run Civ 5 on its own. I noticed (slowtarget) that in your System Req. FAQ, you said that the Intel HD is roughly equivalent to the minimum, and I know my card is much better than the Intel HD, through experience, so shouldn't I be albe to play lower settings with a good performance?

Thanks for helping,

Billy

i got the intel HD.. and so far ive put everything on low video settings except for leader animation on medium... and i see no lag.. but then again i was playing a small game with 6 civs. so idk if when i play bigger games that game will be laggy or not.

though i tried to put everything on max... to see what would happened and it was laggy lol..

[builder680]

Billy,

Yeah, as I said I wasn't certain whether your graphics were integrated or not. I've never owned an ATI card and my laptop is a hunk of junk for school, so I'm deficient in knowledge of both categories. Since you say it's a card, what is making you think it's sharing memory? Is there some kind of message telling you that?

[Kevik]

I can run civ5 on my dell ispiron but it is kinda slow and a little buggy (as in all word are unreadable)

[Billybob25]

Billy,

Yeah, as I said I wasn't certain whether your graphics were integrated or not. I've never owned an ATI card and my laptop is a hunk of junk for school, so I'm deficient in knowledge of both categories. Since you say it's a card, what is making you think it's sharing memory? Is there some kind of message telling you that?

Hello,

Here is a quote from the manufacturers website:

type : ATI Mobility Radeon™ HD 5145 supporting HyperMemory™ technology
memory : 512 MB dedicated VRAM (total available graphics memory using HyperMemory™ technology can be up to 1,530 MB with a 32-bit operating system and 3 GB system memory or 2,810 MB with a 64-bit operating system and 5 GB system memory)
memory type : DDR3 Video RAM (resp. Video RAM and system memory combined)
connected bus : PCI Express®

Also, if I go into my DxDiag, it says my graphics card (yes, it is a card defininitely because it uses a PCI-E, as you can see above) has 2.2 GB of total graphics memory.
So I have dedicated memory + HyperMemory (shared basically). Any reason why?

Thanks,

Billy

[slowtarget]

My graphics card is most definitely not integrated, as it is based on a previous dedicated card. I have 512mb of DEDICATED VRAM, so I am not sure why my computer thinks I need shared memory.

I'm under no illusions. However, some integrated cards are willing to use that shared segment (technically, Vista and Win7 make the same shared memory available to discrete cards in desktops, but the hardware/drivers are set to pretty much never use it). From my understanding (which isn't quite expert-level) this is more useful for handling high resolutions than for texture work, as texture usage is far too GPU intense to use the significantly lower system bus access to main system memory. This is important when thinking about Civ 5 performance.

Just to put something into perspective, the graphics card I have is faster than a ATI Radeon 4570 but only slighty slower than an ATI Mobility Radeon HD 5470.

Are you sure? From these benchmarks, you're below both of them. I hope you're not evaluating video power by saying 5145 > 4570, thus 5145 is faster than 4570. Going by the numbers I'm seeing, your 5145 is insignificantly less capable than the 4500 series, putting you right at the same level of the HD2600XT Mobility. Now that matches the minimum requirements except for:

EDIT: If the 'Mobility' part of my graphics card is making you think it is integrated, this in fact is the way that ATI/AMD decide to tell you that this is a laptop graphics card. Nvidia do the same, by adding an M at the end of their laptop graphics cards; eg. Nvidia GeForce GT 330M.

The "Mobility" is more than just a tag for notebooks. In almost all cases a "mobility" chip is a degraded form of the base card. In your case, the HD2600XT Mobility takes a 16% hit on its core speed and an unfortunate 50% hit on its memory speed. This means that its less capable than the desktop HD2600XT, and the huge memory speed drop is going to degrade performance in Civ 5 more than other games.

Note that the minimum requirements name the non-Mobility card. Thus, while you have all of the functional capabilities of the minimum requirements, in truth, you are probably below the performance of the minimum requirements.

[slowtarget]

Also, if I go into my DxDiag, it says my graphics card (yes, it is a card defininitely because it uses a PCI-E, as you can see above)

Many (most?) integrated graphics cards also use the PCIe bus. There are two types of integrated chips now: On CPU chipsets (such as the Intel HD series) and "on-board" chipsets which are low-power chips integrated into the motherboard. In theory, nothing stops an "integrated" video chipset from having high performance, but it's much harder to cool and power them unless they've been designed to handle such things (which isn't common).

has 2.2 GB of total graphics memory. So I have dedicated memory + HyperMemory (shared basically). Any reason why?

Because you're using Vista/Win7. This is a standard part of the OS (allowing a portion of physical system memory to be made available to the video hardware) but it only gets used if its supported (ie: asked for) by your card and drivers. Most cards with normal amounts of on-card graphics memory are set to virtually never use that extra memory. It doesn't stop some marketing info from trying to brag about it, though.

[Billybob25]

Hello,

Do you think there is any point investing in Civ 5? Would Civ 4 be a more beneficial buy? Should I download the demo to see how my laptop plays?

Thanks,

Billy

PS. You would think I could achieve minimum settings, as the minimum includes Intel HD, and I'm fairly sure this card is better than Intel HD. Am I wrong?

[slowtarget]

Your card is somewhat equal to Nehalem (First-Gen Core i3/5/7) HD Graphics. Unfortunately, that's about the best we can say. Graphics performance isn't a simple thing. Places like PassMark give a single integer score, but that's almost insultingly simple, as the actual performance of a card in a game is affected by a dozen different things. Some games stress some sub-systems more than others. Your card probably does beat out Intel HD for simpler games like Starcraft II. However, Civ 5 is very texture-intense and that stresses video memory controllers. Your lower speed memory bandwidth is going to hold your card back.

That said, plenty of people have gotten the game running on cards with even lower performance, some of them with more stability than much higher performance cards.

Try the demo. Take a look to see how well it handles. Also check your temperatures. Some cards --especially Core2 and first-gen Core i's-- are putting out enough heat to cause corruption. It will be up to you to judge from there.

[Hellogoodbye123]

Your card is somewhat equal to Nehalem (First-Gen Core i3/5/7) HD Graphics. Unfortunately, that's about the best we can say. Graphics performance isn't a simple thing. Places like PassMark give a single integer score, but that's almost insultingly simple, as the actual performance of a card in a game is affected by a dozen different things. Some games stress some sub-systems more than others. Your card probably does beat out Intel HD for simpler games like Starcraft II. However, Civ 5 is very texture-intense and that stresses video memory controllers. Your lower speed memory bandwidth is going to hold your card back.

That said, plenty of people have gotten the game running on cards with even lower performance, some of them with more stability than much higher performance cards.

Try the demo. Take a look to see how well it handles. Also check your temperatures. Some cards --especially Core2 and first-gen Core i's-- are putting out enough heat to cause corruption. It will be up to you to judge from there.

hey i got intel HD !! lol.. put everything on low thats what i do.. its all about the gameplay :P lol plus its not like its pixels like civ 1 lol..
i put it on everything high to test it out, and it wasnt laggy, but you could sense it a bit.. and the graphics looked very similar.. except for the nice clouds.. the nice shadows.. the nice food plantations haha, BUT the cities still look like cardboard boxes on top of each other.. i thought it be this glorious scene very dissapointed.. just put everything on low... the black blocks that represent the clouds arent that bad.. lol

[Hellogoodbye123]

and yes try the demo.. it should be an exact replica of what the actual game should feel like...

[Shiav]

and yes try the demo.. it should be an exact replica of what the actual game should feel like...

yes and no. my laptop runs the first 200 turns fine, but when i go for my 100 unit army madness on huge maps it starts to slow down

[Hellogoodbye123]

yes and no. my laptop runs the first 200 turns fine, but when i go for my 100 unit army madness on huge maps it starts to slow down

100 unit madness? is that how multiplayer is ?? (gulp)..lol
well the demo isnt that long.. :P llol

maybe if you had all your settings on low !! lol

[slowtarget]

Yes, the problem with using the demo as the (only) measure of how your system will do is that it does not give you a full game, and its the late game that stresses systems and causes the most issues.

This is why its useful to note the framerate and temperature of the card in the demo. Those are probably your best indication of how stressed the card is and how well it will handle the next 200 turns.

[Billybob25]

Hello,

How can I note the frame rate? Does the game have some cheat or option to show this?
How could I record the fan temperature? If I do get Civ 5, I would also have a cooling fan as well, as I should be getting one soon, so that my laptop doesn't overheat when playing games.

If you can help, that would be great.

Billy

EDIT: My laptop doesn't overheat usually while playing games, but I am getting one in case, and to make sure it doesn't when my laptop starts getting tired.

[Billybob25]

Hello,

I have started to play the Demo, however, I find that when I start playing, after settling my first city, I get an error message saying "Civilisation 5 has stopped working (etc.)". I was running it in Dx 10/11, which my card supports, and I had the default video settings. Is there a reason for this?

Billy

[Hellogoodbye123]

oh oh seems like the end of the road :0 because I use 10/11 .. get Intel i7 desktop

[slowtarget]

Hello,

I have started to play the Demo, however, I find that when I start playing, after settling my first city, I get an error message saying "Civilisation 5 has stopped working (etc.)". I was running it in Dx 10/11, which my card supports, and I had the default video settings. Is there a reason for this?

DX11 is more hardware intense than DX9. The default video settings are probably too high.

[Hellogoodbye123]

DX11 is more hardware intense than DX9. The default video settings are probably too high.

if i pick dx9 will it have less lag?
i have no lag close to 200 turns.. but i want to ensure i have no lag lol.. i guess ill switch to that instead..

[Billybob25]

Hello,

The demo won't allow me to open Dx9 version, and Dx10/11 still crashes. I guess I will give up on Civ 5 now. Thanks for everyones help so far.

Should I get Civ 4 instead?

Billy

[mj2c]

if i pick dx9 will it have less lag?

Yes I would think so. I have a well under spec nVidia 8200m on my laptop and the speed difference between DX9 and DX10/11 is actually quite large for me.

[Hellogoodbye123]

sounds good I will be sure to switch to that when I go on multiplayer

[Billybob25]

Hello,

How would this laptops fare (if I decide to buy one)? Will they play the game, and what kind of settings?

Laptop 1

Processor: Intel Core i3 - 2330M
(Dual Core ~ 2.2 GHz)

RAM: 4 GB DDR3

Graphics Card: AMD Radeon HD 6470M
(512 MB dedicated memory)

Laptop 2

Processor: Intel Core i5 - 450M
(Dual Core ~ 2.4 GHz)

RAM: 4 GB DDR3

Graphics Card: ATI Mobility Radeon HD 5450
(512 MB dedicated memory)

If you can help, that would be great.

Billy

[Hellogoodbye123]

Idk much about graphic card but both lap tops would work for ram and processor... why not Intel i7 processor on a desktop lol

[Billybob25]

Idk much about graphic card but both lap tops would work for ram and processor... why not Intel i7 processor on a desktop lol

Hello,

I wish to have a laptop, specifically a more portable one, and these are the best specs I could get for my price range.

Anyone else have an opinion of the above laptop specs?

Thanks,

Billy

[Hellogoodbye123]

remember my thread there's a link to steam .. go on it .. search civ 5 it also provides the requirements needed it could also help

[AngryViking]

Hello,

How would this laptops fare (if I decide to buy one)? Will they play the game, and what kind of settings?

Laptop 1

Processor: Intel Core i3 - 2330M
(Dual Core ~ 2.2 GHz)

RAM: 4 GB DDR3

Graphics Card: AMD Radeon HD 6470M
(512 MB dedicated memory)

Laptop 2

Processor: Intel Core i5 - 450M
(Dual Core ~ 2.4 GHz)

RAM: 4 GB DDR3

Graphics Card: ATI Mobility Radeon HD 5450
(512 MB dedicated memory)

If you can help, that would be great.

Billy

I haven't done exhaustive research or anything but if the prices are equal I would say that laptop 1 would be a better bet for gaming than Laptop 2. The i5 450M is the previous generation while the i3 2330M is Sandy Bridge, which is the latest generation, so even if the i5 runs at a faster speed the i3 *should* make up for it with a slightly better architecture.

Also, as far as the graphics cards, I believe the 6470M edges out the Mobility 5450 in performance too. From what I was able to lookup with a quick google it has a slightly faster core speed and I believe it is the next generation up as well.

To be blunt though: I wouldn't expect CIV 5 to run fast on either of those laptops especially towards the end of a game, and I'd keep the settings at the lowest possible, and not play anything above standard map size with the standard amount of civs.

[slowtarget]

Hello,

How would this laptops fare (if I decide to buy one)? Will they play the game, and what kind of settings?

Laptop 1
Processor: Intel Core i3 - 2330M (Dual Core ~ 2.2 GHz)
RAM: 4 GB DDR3
Graphics Card: AMD Radeon HD 6470M (512 MB dedicated memory)

Laptop 2
Processor: Intel Core i5 - 450M(Dual Core ~ 2.4 GHz)
RAM: 4 GB DDR3
Graphics Card: ATI Mobility Radeon HD 5450 (512 MB dedicated memory)

There's not much of a comparison here. Laptop 1 is superior to Laptop 2 in every single category (even RAM, as its probably running the DIMMs at an inconsequentially higher speed). An i3 2300M (at 2.2GHz) is probably as powerful as a previous generation CPU (like the i5 450) running at 2.6 or 2.8GHz. Of course, that's not going to be all that noticeable either.

What you will notice is the lower power draw and lower heat production of the 2330 and 6470 over the 450 and 5450.

If these are both acceptable prices, I don't see any reason to consider the second one. The first is superior.