Why don't they just rename the game?

[¿SnùffleKítty?]

I mean, that's basically all these bitter old x-com fans have got right? 2K took the name of a game that nobody wants to remake, and pasted it on their shiny new fps. So they get to cry about it.

I for one would love to hear something new about this game. No new news since what, June of 2010? But the forum mod'll just jump in and say "soon soon," so I guess there is no point on dwelling on that.

No, but really; release something, anything. Screenshots, videos, or how about an interview or something? Media coverage would do wonders for turning this depressing forum around.

At this point it's just the same 6 guys crying about 2K not making the game that they want to play. Why should the developers care what anybody in the forum has to say? All I see is open hostility. Might as well make a sticky that reads: "Hey Developers, all your hard work is ☺☺☺☺."

- Snuffles

[Nosmirc]

Who said nobody wants it remade? Don't want it remade like THIS. Big difference. (heck, there's even a topic about how we would have liked to see a remake done...) And if this sort of thing was happening to a favourite game of YOURS, into something that really doesn't fit what has existing in the series prior, you'd probably be just as crabby, so don't be a hater .

[Brian Damage]

It is in no way a case of "Nobody wants to remake it" (just look at the fan remakes and the slew of games like Xenonauts and the UFO series, who try to get as close to being X-Com as possible while remaining A) Modern and B) Copyright infringement-free). It's far more a case of "2K is the only one allowed to directly 'remake' it on account of them being the ones who ended up owning the rights".

And now, as you say, they've just slapped the name on an unrelated game instead of actually, y'know, remaking it. Cue massive fan irritation. I'm sure there are a lot of developers out there who would have jumped at the chance to do a faithful remake.

Incidentally, you're not the first to suggest renaming the game, though funnily enough every time I've seen it suggested up 'til now it's been by a "bitter old X-Com fan".

Oh, and I'd say it's less "The same six guys crying" as the "The same six guys hanging around to directly or indirectly prevent the game's one hardcore fan from controlling dialogue on the forums", but that's just on this website. You want more hate? Go to somewhere like RPGCodex or Something Awful - or to any comments thread for a preview of this game, for that matter. We were just the ones who could be bothered signing up at the 2K forums, or who already were, which itself might suggest that there's not much overlap between the audiences for 2K's games and hardcore X-Com fans.

[AlphaCent]

A point that was raised many times. It really doesn't help that the XCOM lable was slapped on a preexisting idea..talk about dishonesty!

[Cpl_Facehugger]

You know, X-Com fans were in favor of calling it Xenoshock until the mods cracked down on that kind of talk. It wouldn't be very difficult at all to change at this point, and I'mma sure there's more to be gained from association with the Bioshock franchise than there is the X-Com one, considering how the X-Com fanbase has come out overwhelmingly in opposition to XCOM.

[EaglePryde]

I mean, that's basically all these bitter old x-com fans have got right? 2K took the name of a game that nobody wants to remake, and pasted it on their shiny new fps. So they get to cry about it.

I for one would love to hear something new about this game. No new news since what, June of 2010? But the forum mod'll just jump in and say "soon soon," so I guess there is no point on dwelling on that.

No, but really; release something, anything. Screenshots, videos, or how about an interview or something? Media coverage would do wonders for turning this depressing forum around.

At this point it's just the same 6 guys crying about 2K not making the game that they want to play. Why should the developers care what anybody in the forum has to say? All I see is open hostility. Might as well make a sticky that reads: "Hey Developers, all your hard work is ☺☺☺☺."

- Snuffles

So because only a hand full of people post here makes you think we are the only X-COM fans in the world who have something against what has been done? How about you go and look for other sites and you'll see plenty of negative posts.

Most X-COM fans past on XCOM and never even considered in buying it nor registering on the boards to say something.

And bevor you try to rant try to dig up some facts. This is some useless talk you just delivered.

[Nosmirc]

You know, X-Com fans were in favor of calling it Xenoshock until the mods cracked down on that kind of talk. It wouldn't be very difficult at all to change at this point, and I'mma sure there's more to be gained from association with the Bioshock franchise than there is the X-Com one, considering how the X-Com fanbase has come out overwhelmingly in opposition to XCOM.

I would hope 2k could come up with a more interesting name then THAT lol...my pet name for it is XINO (X-Com in Name Only)

[fastestlouigie]

So because only a hand full of people post here makes you think we are the only X-COM fans in the world who have something against what has been done? How about you go and look for other sites and you'll see plenty of negative posts.

Most X-COM fans past on XCOM and never even considered in buying it nor registering on the boards to say something.

And bevor you try to rant try to dig up some facts. This is some useless talk you just delivered.

Yes indeed I concur, there are many X-Com fans who are very unhappy/angry with 2k's use of the XCOM name being slapped onto their latest FPS, just because they acquired the rights to the name. I live in hope that one day Julian Gollop gets to remake his wonderful game with the latest technology. Dreams......

[ShanDaMan]

We all would like to see the name changed. And I think we also stick around because the people who own the IP need to be reminded that they own something very valuable. I'm hoping that my input has at least been heard by the people who make decisions about this game and any future games. After all, this is the official forum of the IP holders.

I'm sure we also agree that we'd like something new to talk about. A screenshot, video, anything.

But the biggest concern I have is whether I'm included in the "6 guys."

[Shrike]

So because only a hand full of people post here makes you think we are the only X-COM fans in the world who have something against what has been done? How about you go and look for other sites and you'll see plenty of negative posts.

Most X-COM fans past on XCOM and never even considered in buying it nor registering on the boards to say something.

And then there's fans like me who know the other guys here seem to have it handled on their own and don't need me, hence why I don't post much either. :P

[Aegeri]

You more than likely are ShanDaMan, because there are only around six people who post on the forum anyway. That does show just how excited all the Halo/MW2 fans 2K were trying to sell this game to were about naming it X-Com (in short, not at all).

[vitalis]

now i play x-com apocalypse, on win7 , via dosbox, plays nice and i have alot of fun, game old, graphics old but idea is far beter than todays uber super graphic games, in xcom i doubt be alien ships, i dont think we wil have something to fly to shoot them, this gamedont have rights to that name, and no info about game i want to believe i wrong, but i think this be a shooter 1 time playable.

[AlphaCent]

When i first played apocalypse i was just thrilled with all the stuff that was in. Initially i didn't have a clue what half of it was, but it was so much fun discovering new options as the game progressed. The graphics don't really distract you as in some other older games, like for example the lack of a prone position in previous games. Cover mattered so much more in apoc...it really is the technically best of the series.

[BandofGypsies]

apoc...it really is the technically best of the series.

Couldn't agree more.. actually playing Apoc now over the long weekend.
It's depth is amazing.. been low on cash so I've been constantly hitting Sirius for some psiclone to sell.. hit n fade.
FREEDOM. Freedom to attack..raid, research... it's essentially a little x-com sandbox.

Anyhow.. to assume 2K deserves special treatment is ridiculous. Priavte enterprise should deliver what the market wants. While i wouldnt enjoy hearing lay offs as a result of a change of direction, they really should have paid more attention to what X-com is. What they made so far isnt..

6 guys complaining?.. no. An internets worth of voices.. check the forums anywhere beyond here.. the same points keep getting brought up. This new 'imagining' is so far from the mark it's comical. 15 years of missed opportunites make one a patient person.. but extremely dissapointed as well. Extremely...To say we are merely saying '2k's work is ☺☺☺☺' shows your lack of reading about what makes us so damned cheesed off.

[Ksarith]

Couldn't agree more.. actually playing Apoc now over the long weekend.
It's depth is amazing.. been low on cash so I've been constantly hitting Sirius for some psiclone to sell.. hit n fade.
FREEDOM. Freedom to attack..raid, research... it's essentially a little x-com sandbox.

Anyhow.. to assume 2K deserves special treatment is ridiculous. Priavte enterprise should deliver what the market wants. While i wouldnt enjoy hearing lay offs as a result of a change of direction, they really should have paid more attention to what X-com is. What they made so far isnt..

6 guys complaining?.. no. An internets worth of voices.. check the forums anywhere beyond here.. the same points keep getting brought up. This new 'imagining' is so far from the mark it's comical. 15 years of missed opportunites make one a patient person.. but extremely dissapointed as well. Extremely...To say we are merely saying '2k's work is ☺☺☺☺' shows your lack of reading about what makes us so damned cheesed off.

I would say at this point they have probably heard all the complaints and from what Liz said I'm thinking they may have made some changes to more closely follow what the fans wanted. That said I think what they had in the beginning would be good as a X-Com origins type game.

[Brian Damage]

Not really - X-Com was canonically created in the late 1990's as a multinational organisation.

Maybe if they were depicting a predecessor organisation, and used the original X-Com aliens towards the end, then hit us with the aliens being all "We'll be back!"-ish and showed some people at the UN filing a contingency plan labeled "X-Com Initiative" for later use... but I'd still be unhappy with the horrid 50's asthetic, so lets hope they changed that at the very least.

[Ksarith]

Not really - X-Com was canonically created in the late 1990's as a multinational organisation.

Maybe if they were depicting a predecessor organisation, and used the original X-Com aliens towards the end, then hit us with the aliens being all "We'll be back!"-ish and showed some people at the UN filing a contingency plan labeled "X-Com Initiative" for later use... but I'd still be unhappy with the horrid 50's asthetic, so lets hope they changed that at the very least.

Hence the origins part. X-Com didnt spring up out of nowhere.

[Brian Damage]

Well according to canon, it kind of did. There was a meeting of big-money nations in Geneva in 1998 to discuss the strange spate of flying saucers that had been whizzing around and getting up to all sorts of naughtiness, and what to do about them, and suddenly, BAM. X-Com*, an organisation with nothing but highly advanced Earth technology, which doesn't really fit with there being some sort of predecessor that had been collecting alien tech.

I'm not saying they couldn't go back on their word that the new game has nothing to do with the storyline of the old game, and change things so that the game revolves around an American investigative organisation (which would very specifically NOT be allowed to be called X-Com, or XCOM, or whatever) from the 50's that fights off an alien scout mission, somehow misplaces all its gathered tech, and then lodges a proposal for said multinational fighting force that could then be dug out of a filing cabinet at the UN in 1998... but as I said, even in that case I'd still be ticked at having to run around in their unreal Pleasantville setting, which wouldn't really fit into the rather grim X-Com universe.

*Though if I recall correctly it might have been named "X-Inv" for a few months prior to the start of the game, in preparation for when it'd actually be able to do the whole "Com" thing.

[AlphaCent]

"blobatovs" and "X-COM predecessor"

Do i have to point out what a big no no that is? It's almost as bad as pod's Neo X-com idea.

[Brian Damage]

Yeah, I was just throwing it out there as a cynically glum best case scenario for what I think they might actually end up doing (trying to quiet us fans by shoehorning the game into the X-Com timeline), which is simultaneously the worst case in the context of what we really want out of a retool (because it would inevitably be incredibly clumsy, in no small part because from what we've seen the game as it is just doesn't work as an X-Com game, stylistically or mechanically).

[obi-one-kaboozi]

I have been an XCOM fan for many years, but rarely participate in forums. In fact I've been a gamer since my old IBM 8088 ran some good old text based games (Yes, I'm now in my 40s, have money and still game with the best of them). XCOM was one of my all time favorite games. In all this time I dont think I have ever participated in an online forum discussing my love of games though I've owned many from all Genre's. For XCOM however I feel obligated to add my opinion since one noisy fan often represents far greater silent numbers.

I have to agree with the other XCOM fans. This game so far has two things in common with the original game. 1, the name and 2, it has aliens. But that pretty much sums up any generic alien invasion book, movie etc. I have been waiting for a reboot of XCOM for years and starving to lay down some cash on new copies of a game that took XCOM and brought it up to date with graphics and not change it, but perhaps add to it. This game is NOT XCOM and leaves me with a bitter taste for 2K management. I think 2k makes great games, but you dont change a successful franchise (Last I recall I think XCOM is in the list of all time greatest PC games) and expect not to lose the original fan base.

MY TAKE? YES, PLEASE RENAME THIS GAME. Hopefully someday someone can use the name and create a true reboot. Kind of like trying to call Battlestar Galactica the next episode of Star Wars. Both great Science Fiction, but to try and call them the same thing? Heresy :P

[podtech115]

This game so far has two things in common with the original game. 1, the name and 2, it has aliens.

I hate when fans lie in your face like you're Retarded or something, don't you?
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost...&postcount=825
http://www.ign.com/videos/2010/08/05...ectid=14252327

[obi-one-kaboozi]

Dont you hate it when people dont like what you say, so they accuse you of a lie? To lie means an attempt to deceive. To post an opinion based on my perspective of what I think is the only redeemable similarity between the new FPS and the old XCOM is just that. Get over it moron.

[Nosmirc]

Man, don't be a coppa pasta Pod

Haven't I said your thoughts might be better recieved if YOU articulated them rather then just posting links and expecting people to somehow come to the conclusion you have, only to get made when they invariably DON'T reach the same conclusion?

[japester]

Okay, let's give all the "retarded" and "moron" comments a rest. Civility is not optional on this forum. You have the rest of the internet to act like that---let's have a civil discussion here. [/moderator mode]

Dont you hate it when people dont like what you say, so they accuse you of a lie? To lie means an attempt to deceive. To post an opinion based on my perspective of what I think is the only redeemable similarity between the new FPS and the old XCOM is just that.

[fan mode] Okay, to be fair, you didn't originally say these were the only "redeemable" similarities. You said it only has "two things in common with the original game". Big difference. But your original comments is pretty standard among all the complaints I've read. In truth, there are a lot of similarities between the original and XCOM, but some fans prefer to ignore them all simply because they are upset about the change to a FPS format. For the record, I still have my original boxed copy of UFO Defense somewhere around here. I had graduated college when that game came out, so I was with the franchise from the very beginning. Point being, I'm as big a fan as anyone. And while I would prefer another turn-based game, the reality is that X-COM was being turned into a FPS as far back as 10 years ago with X-COM: Enforcer. And it sat dormant for 10 years before 2K stepped in. So any attempt to characterize this as an attempt to drastically alter the franchise is patently false. X-COM has been dead for a long, long time. It's back. It may not be perfect, but what is? I'm glad to see X-COM finally getting some love. And I'm not going to close my mind off to the possibility of exploring this rich setting from a fresh perspective.

[Nosmirc]

But your original comments is pretty standard among all the complaints I've read. In truth, there are a lot of similarities between the original and XCOM, but some fans prefer to ignore them all simply because they are upset about the change to a FPS format.

Ah. No. I can understand the misconception, since I wouldn't expect too many people would have the patience to read all the posts here, especially when it's so full of nerdly goodness. But I would say the departure from the paramilitary organization, and timeline setting to Pleasantville of the 50s, and enemies that really haven't struck a chord with fans are by far much bigger factors in the unhappiness in the games direction. Some of us, myself included, have even said X-Com CAN work in the FPS format.

Personally, two things would help this title alot for me. One: Make it Modern. I can't relate to Pleasantville of the 50s. That's 30 years before I was born, and Pleasantville is basically one way of saying a fake American community. But throw in cell phones, smart phones, the internet, etc, stuff like that I understand and can relate to. Everyone here can.

Two: Classic aliens/traditional UFO lore. Honestly, part of the charm of the original series for me(and this might be part of why Apoc didn't appeal to me that much) was that the classic aliens were based off UFO lore. From ship designs to Elerium, to Sectoids and a few other races, you don't have to look very far to find UFO stories featuring the elements you can find in X-Com.

So yeah. A prequel type game leading up to the first alien war could be a pretty cool game. I can just imagine it. You're in a branch of the FBI that gets the crap jobs. Investigating claims that are, for the most part, completely bogus. Like Dr Johnathan Reed. But gradually, you learn of a conspiracy to hide the truth, and the climax of the game is the truth being exposed, and sparking the first alien war in earnest. The pacing and dialogue could be a ton of fun. Experiencing skeptical and bored FBI agents as they discover that not all UFO reports are bogus could be fun, in a quirky X-Files fashion.

I know that may sound a little weird coming from me, having said this game seems to resemble X-Files more then X-Com, but that's largely because of the Oileans. They even do the oily black eye possession dealy for crying out loud!

[AlphaCent]

Okay, let's give all the "retarded" and "moron" comments a rest. Civility is not optional on this forum. You have the rest of the internet to act like that---let's have a civil discussion here. [/moderator mode]



[fan mode] Okay, to be fair, you didn't originally say these were the only "redeemable" similarities. You said it only has "two things in common with the original game". Big difference. But your original comments is pretty standard among all the complaints I've read. In truth, there are a lot of similarities between the original and XCOM, but some fans prefer to ignore them all simply because they are upset about the change to a FPS format. For the record, I still have my original boxed copy of UFO Defense somewhere around here. I had graduated college when that game came out, so I was with the franchise from the very beginning. Point being, I'm as big a fan as anyone. And while I would prefer another turn-based game, the reality is that X-COM was being turned into a FPS as far back as 10 years ago with X-COM: Enforcer. And it sat dormant for 10 years before 2K stepped in. So any attempt to characterize this as an attempt to drastically alter the franchise is patently false. X-COM has been dead for a long, long time. It's back. It may not be perfect, but what is? I'm glad to see X-COM finally getting some love. And I'm not going to close my mind off to the possibility of exploring this rich setting from a fresh perspective.

no no no

First of all it's sad that we need to have a page with similarities between both games. It just adds to the desperate situation we are in.


As for the bold part. That's what i was afraid of...people will equate both games as being the same. Need i have to remind you that XCOM wants to totally eradicate the notion of the previous games. 2k doesn't want X-com to start with the original one, but with their version. And once again...it doesn't help that a previous, completely unrelated game idea, got the title XCOM slapped on. 2K didn't even want to start from the ground up.
So equating both games is a really bad idea.

Why are you looking forward to play XCOM and not Xenoshock for instance? The similarities with the original series are more or less inconsequential.

[Brian Damage]

In truth, there are a lot of similarities between the original and XCOM, but some fans prefer to ignore them all simply because they are upset about the change to a FPS format.

The specific similarities are very few (basically the names "Elerium" and "XCOM"), the remaining similarities are depressingly broad (you fight aliens at alien invasion sites chosen via a map with opportunities to upgrade your equipment in between). Everything else smacks far more of a mashup of Bioshock and X-Files than X-Com.

For the record, I still have my original boxed copy of UFO Defense somewhere around here. I had graduated college when that game came out, so I was with the franchise from the very beginning. Point being, I'm as big a fan as anyone.

*Golf clap*

And while I would prefer another turn-based game, the reality is that X-COM was being turned into a FPS as far back as 10 years ago with X-COM: Enforcer.

Ah, no. Enforcer was a third person shooter. Alliance was the interesting-looking FPS, which I believe was sadly cannibalised at short notice to make Enforcer because Hasbro had no idea computer games took so long to develop and kind of panicked when the development period went over the six month mark. Enforcer ended up sucking and not being very relevant to the X-Com series.

Incidentally, around the same time they were working on Alliance they were also developing X-Com: Genesis, which was intended to be an attempt to return to the things everyone liked about the first game. It wasn't necessarily going to be turn-based (though I believe that was being considered as an option), but everything else was going to be much as it was in UFO: Enemy Unknown, from the Geoscape/Tactical Map division to the squad-based eagle's-eye-view tactical combat.

And it sat dormant for 10 years before 2K stepped in. So any attempt to characterize this as an attempt to drastically alter the franchise is patently false.

After everything that's been learned and said about that game, I'm not sure that logically follows, dude. It doesn't get much more drastic in terms of alteration than slapping X-Com's name on an unrelated game.

X-COM has been dead for a long, long time. It's back. It may not be perfect, but what is? I'm glad to see X-COM finally getting some love. And I'm not going to close my mind off to the possibility of exploring this rich setting from a fresh perspective.

Except even the people in charge have said it's not the same setting.

[Shrike]

X-COM has been dead for a long, long time.

No, it hasn't. There's quite a number of people who still play it. Others who have attempted to remake it, properly I might add. And it's received several rewards from various gaming sites such as IGN. X-COM may have been sleeping, but it's been hardly dead, and definitely not forgotten.

It's back.

I beg to differ.

It may not be perfect, but what is?

This just sounds like an excuse to promote laziness. You're right, the game's not perfect. In fact, it's pretty much the exact opposite of what people have been wanting. Like AlphaCent said, the only reason XCOM's back is because of an afterthought. I don't think it's unreasonable that fans aren't going to settle being handed crap just because hey, nothing's perfect. I don't expect perfection. But I do think that this rendition of XCOM missed the mark so much... it really shouldn't be that hard to ask for a game that at least uses the same setting. There's no reason it shouldn't. It's not like it would have been prohibitive, changed production costs, or development time, or anything. Models are models, story is story. They could have made assets and a script that actually fit with the other X-COM games just as easily as making up their entirely new setting. It's not impossible for them to have made a game that actually made use of the license they paid for. I can't even put into words just how utterly mindboggling it is to me that they'd go this route. I just don't buy the line "2K knows best, old X-COM would have obviously failed." If their writers couldn't have figured out a way to present the original X-COM setting to the current generation, then they need to hire better writers, because they're not thinking hard enough. There's really no excuse for "We couldn't figure out how to make it work," especially when others here have presented ideas that would be absolutely awesome to play. Fortunately, I don't think it was the fault of the writers or anyone else on the dev team really for screwing this up. The sole mistake came from whoever got the idea of slapping the XCOM title onto a game that originally wasn't meant to be XCOM halfway through development.

And I'm not going to close my mind off to the possibility of exploring this rich setting from a fresh perspective.

And that's fine. Just realize, a lot of us weren't looking for a fresh perspective. Not this drastically at least. I can't speak for everyone, but it does look like at least some of us here agree we could have lived with an FPS. The dealbreaker was that we wanted something that actually paid respect to the originals, not one that tossed them out the window and told us to forget they ever existed. It's disrespectful to the fans, and disrespectful to the developers who originally made X-COM possible.

[AlphaCent]

Yep, that's the problem...2K didn't even try to make an X-com game. The idea for Fallout 3 for instance was more or less thought out with Fallout in mind. XCOM was thought up with Bioshock in mind. Really, i have yet to see a game company fail so humongously.

[ShanDaMan]

When you say that the change to FPS was what X-COM fans hate most, I'm sure that was the case at first. But as has been mentioned already, the details that came out thereafter made it much worse. The "Lost in the 50's" setting, the focus on a single character, the loss of global control, the negative comments about the original aliens from the developer interviews, the blobatov, the comments similar to "we distilled X-COM down to it's essence"... it all just kept going downhill.

I think we became so vocal because we like X-COM so much and have been waiting for a sequel or remake for such a long time. However, many have continued playing the game through the decade-plus waiting period. It is so good that I'm willing to play with old graphics and interfaces just to experience that gameplay and story.

So while I'm certain that there is a market for a faithful remake of the original game, I'm willing to try an FPS game called XCOM especially if it has been designed to appeal to fans of the X-COM universe and connect with its story. But, don't expect it to be an easy sell, especially if you tell me up front that everything is so very different. Show me what is the same.

I'd even consider playing a game called "The Bureau vs. The Blobs" if it looked fun. Then I wouldn't be comparing it to anything else, just evaluating the game on it's own merits.

[Cpl_Facehugger]

In truth, there are a lot of similarities between the original and XCOM, but some fans prefer to ignore them all simply because they are upset about the change to a FPS format.

Could you elucidate please? I mean, are we talking about similarities like "both have aliens" and "both have a group called XCOM?"

'Cuz there's a lot of superficial similarities, but most of those evaporate when you examine them with a critical eye. There's "research", but it involves taking pictures and tossing in Elerium to a magic plot device and getting out a zany madcap weapon like a blobatov cocktail. There's a "base", but you don't seem to have much control over it. There's a "squad" but it's three guys including the player, and squad control appears MIA.

For the record, I still have my original boxed copy of UFO Defense somewhere around here. I had graduated college when that game came out, so I was with the franchise from the very beginning. Point being, I'm as big a fan as anyone. And while I would prefer another turn-based game, the reality is that X-COM was being turned into a FPS as far back as 10 years ago with X-COM: Enforcer. And it sat dormant for 10 years before 2K stepped in. So any attempt to characterize this as an attempt to drastically alter the franchise is patently false. X-COM has been dead for a long, long time. It's back. It may not be perfect, but what is? I'm glad to see X-COM finally getting some love. And I'm not going to close my mind off to the possibility of exploring this rich setting from a fresh perspective.

It kind of undermines your point bringing up Enforcer, since Enforcer is almost universally hated amongst the fanbase. In fact, I think I'm the only actual fan that Enforcer has, and even then, intellectual honesty compels me to say that it really shouldn't be an X-Com game. ("Alien Murderizer: The Xenocide" would be so much more apt.)

You'd be much better off bringing up Alliance, but that was canceled, and was explicitly going to maintain a lot of the important features of X-Com (squad control, strategic metagame, etc), on top of being a spinoff compared to Genesis. The problem with XCOM is that it appears to be have pretty much nothing in common with X-Com. Reimaginings are one thing... But they generally have to be recognizable as reimaginings.

Like nBSG having battlestars and cylon centurions and vipers. Or the invasion of the body snatchers having... Well, body snatchers. Or the Thing being set in an antarctic research station. That kind of deal.

[podtech115]

Okay, let's give all the "retarded" and "moron" comments a rest. Civility is not optional on this forum. You have the rest of the internet to act like that---let's have a civil discussion here. [/moderator mode]

To be fair, when I said "retarded", I was kind-of talking about myself. I didn't insult anyone. I was saying "obi-one-kaboozi" was, in a way, calling me a "retard".

Now it looks like everyone is attacking you, for defending this game.

Haven't I said your thoughts might be better recieved if YOU articulated them rather then just posting links and expecting people to somehow come to the conclusion you have, only to get made when they invariably DON'T reach the same conclusion?

Lazy. I'm just Lazy.

[Codex]

Lets try not to go off topic, please, or break forum rules in the threads. If you have a problem with a moderator's decision, PM them.

[obi-one-kaboozi]

I'm not against FPS, and in fact I have often wondered what a good design would include. I've also loved the idea of real time but still squad based with complete control (pause and play if needed). To be honest, I want what the original had but updated, not really changed. (I want to build bases anywhere on the map, I want to staff them, I want to research, I want to feel like I'm building an organization, I want to manufacture, I want to have tactical missions with squads that I control). You can do that with an FPS but if you get rid of any of those things it just is not what I want and its just another FPS which leaves me wanting all those things. I really dont want to play X-Files, I want to play X-com. That does not mean I wont like an X-Files game, but it does mean I'm still looking for my X-Com. I love FPS games, but there are so many of them now its almost like overload and I'm ready for a remake of the original. Also, 50's? I would love to be in modern times.

[Aegeri]

But your original comments is pretty standard among all the complaints I've read. In truth, there are a lot of similarities between the original and XCOM, but some fans prefer to ignore them all simply because they are upset about the change to a FPS format.

This is an incredibly disengenuous assertion Japester and I would have expected a lot better of you than this. For one thing, most of the similarities are extremely minor and don't actually represent the element from the original that they replace. For example we do know there is a base in XCOM, but we don't know if there are any facility management, base building aspects or even if we can choose where in the US it can be established. We know you go on missions looking for alien activity, but you only take two squadmates who may/may not be controllable and there is no interception in the game.

In reality other than superficial elements, there is very little actually confirmed about the game similar to the originals at all - then there are all the elements CLEARLY from Bioshock (even right down to the research camera!). Not to mention the games combat looks and smells like bioshock as well. So your statement just holds absolutely no water whatsoever.

For the record, I still have my original boxed copy of UFO Defense somewhere around here.

So do I and it doesn't mean a whole lot in this discussion.

Point being, I'm as big a fan as anyone.

No offense, but the last time you said this you were claiming that Terror from the Deep had no sectoids. Without realizing the basic Aquanoid alien was actually a sectoid and clearly so to anyone who had played the game (and researched them). So I'd rather see the beef behind your claims that X-Com and XCOM are indeed similar, because thus far they are really not similar at all. I remember your previous arguments here and they really didn't stack up. Given that nothing has actually changed that we can see (although I am willing to bet with the backlash against the game it certainly has) there isn't really anything making those arguments valid now compared to when they were first made.

And while I would prefer another turn-based game, the reality is that X-COM was being turned into a FPS as far back as 10 years ago with X-COM: Enforcer.

And you think that is a *good* thing? If you didn't get the memo, Enforcer was an absolutely terrible game. From all indications XCOM looks to be going the same way pretty much, unless of course 2K has genuinely LISTENED to the fans. In that case we might have a game with actual X-Com elements in it and the very very very basic thing of commanding the mooks who come on missions with us. I mean if you had read anything that I have been writing on these forums, you'll see I have not demanded a rewrite of the game: but basic things being put in. The ability to control your squadmates and at least a reasonably deep research tree would suffice. I don't expect anything to be truly like the original game, but they can at least make a decent FPS with squad based mechanics to go with shooting aliens. Not rip the hell off bioshock and throw X-Com onto the name for random amusement purposes.

Also Enforcer was a third person shooter and not an FPS. This has little to do with how utterly terrible it was though. You may be thinking of X-Com Alliance, which was an FPS game and was unfortunately canned. It was also much more ambitious than this game in numerous ways and was at the time being designed alongside a turn based remake (which also got canned eventually).

[Nosmirc]

even if we can choose where in the US it can be established.

Totally a deal breaker if I can't build it in Hawaii.

Not to mention the games combat looks and smells like bioshock as well.

How about how similar the letters of the title look to Bioshocks? It's like a cleaner version (now I'm just causing trouble haha)

[vitalis]

beter they give that name and funds to guys who making xenonauts. idea that i cannot intercept an ufo ship, makes me sad, so xcom is not for me, or they think that ufo shooting is with big homemade condensator like in movie.

[AlphaCent]

Please, please 2K, do us all a favor and just rename the game. You probably won't loose many sales, hell, on the contrary...the fans might cheer up and as a gesture of good will buy the game, or just buy the game because it's not named XCOM anymore.

Really...all you have to do is just rename it. Games have been renamed before and the release date is still far.

Just rename it and you'll get rid of all the current nagging, all the future nagging, the bad reputation of misusing a franchise, keep all your work so far, release it sooner, maintain more or less the same sale value. It would instantly make everybody happy and solve every problem with this game. You can even market it as "Inspired by X-com".

And i'd personally spam the ☺☺☺☺ out of game sites that would give you ☺☺☺☺ for renaming it.

Please

[japester]

Sorry about one typo I made up above. I lose track of the X-COM games after the first one because, frankly, that was the only one that was stellar. The rest generally decline in quality. I meant Alliance, not Enforcer, when I said that the franchise was headed into a FPS direction, making 2K's decision to go in that same direction not as much of a departure as everyone makes it out as.

And since these same arguments have been running around in circles on this forum for a long time now, I'm not going to rehash each and every point.

I will note that, despite all the snarky responses to my long-time enjoyment of this series, you can bet your bottom that if I hadn't mentioned that I was there from the beginning, there would have been several responses mentioning how I "just didn't get it" or "must not know X-COM". There's that no-win scenario for ya.

Please don't misinterpret my "dead franchise" to mean that nobody cares about X-COM. That's ludicrous. Of course we care about it, otherwise we wouldn't be arguing so passionately. But the point of the matter is that when people talk about their love of X-COM, the vast majority are focusing on UFO Defense. Which is an ooooooold game. Which had quite a few lackluster sequels. Then a 10 year period of nothing. Point being, when you listen to some of the negativity about XCOM, people act as if UFO Defense came out last year, then 2K snapped up the rights, killing the glorious sequel we all know was in the works. That's all.

Finally, I haven't played XCOM. Nobody here has. All I know is the snippets I read about in the initial releases. The same things listed in the links earlier in the thread. And I see a lot more than "aliens and elerium" to link the two. Research, capture, picking which mission sites to visit, going in with a team, choosing when to depart (risk/reward), some form of base management (I believe this was implied, but I can't find a link), etc. Again, I'm not replying or continuing that particular line of discussion because it's been beaten to death. The facts are out there, people are just willfully ignoring them.

I've waited a long, long time for a worthy sequel to UFO Defense. I have yet to play one. Not the original creators, not those who later bought the rights, nor the various indie attempts have really satisfied my particular yen for an awesome sequel. I'm willing to give 2K a shot. If you guys want to look down on me for that, or think I'm nuts, so be it. But don't say every X-COM fan is dead-set against XCOM. Because I'm proof that is not true.