A better way to visualize your empire/cities?

[AeEsBii]

I wonder if some things about Civ V would be improved by providing certain information in a better way, without actually making changes to the game's mechanics.

For example, currently we only have "food" to represent growth. Mechanically this is fine, but some people miss health. The thing is, hospitals affect food because food is growth and health is growth, therefore food "is health".

This could be addressed by renaming "food" to "growth" and having a tooltip on the city screen explaining where the growth is coming from. X growth generated by farms. Y growth generated by health infrastructure. Z negative growth from unhappiness.

Happiness might also benefit from a name change, to something more like "stability". X stability from happiness (things like coliseums and stadiums), Y stability from loyalty (probably generated by policies and leader traits), Z stability from law (courthouses, policies like Police State), A negative stability from population, B negative stability from number of cities, C negative stability from occupation. This is basically how it already is, but it would be sorted under different headings and make more sense. (After all, an oppressive police state doesn't really make unhappiness disappear. I think we all understand the mechanics of it, but it's jarring to read "Police State reduces unhappiness." With a little name change it can be "Police State suppresses instability from occupation.")

Expansions and mods could later add functionality to the yield sources, but just to start with, it would help bring a civilization to life if yield sources came from different flavors and were written in a way that's pleasing to read.

[Mega-Dolphin]

Very interesting. It adds some more immersion to the game, so that police states don't reduce unhappiness and such. I think stability is a good way to rename unhappiness that still fits with what it does. Growth in place of food is good as well. And the breakdown of where everything is coming from sounds good to me.

[the man of doom]

i dont really llike health replacing growth (assuming i read it rite)

the other one doesnt bother me 1 way or the other

[AeEsBii]

i dont really llike health replacing growth (assuming i read it rite)

Growth would replace food. Because currently hospitals improve your food, and that looks silly, doesn't it?

[the man of doom]

not really

excess food is growth
growth implies growing
and when a city is stagnant it cant have (size 5) 10/10 growth

[istry555]

I would suggest social policies also have a name change.

They don't really function as social policies, they function as cultural traditions (which is why they work with the culture mechanic). Your civilization was violent in the past, i.e. you had a warlike culture back then, so it makes sense that part of your current culture retains that and you can't just change it like the old civic mechanic. I would suggest that an actual government system that can be changed can be implemented in addition, but adding too many mechanics could just clutter the game.

Anyway, rename social policies to traditions or something like that.

[AeEsBii]

I agree. "Social Identity" instead of policy, and "embrace" instead of "adopt". I think the government-related policies (monarchy, communism, etc.) should be renamed, too. That will make it less awkward to add a government system later on, either by mod or expansion.

[AeEsBii]

What the heck, here's the revised policies I'd like, but am currently too lazy to try modding. Every policy branch has a specific opposing branch. Of note, Patronage an Commerce are gone. Their effects are worked into other policies; also, most CS-related policies have a secondary non-CS-related effect, so that they're useful even in games without city-states. And, each branch has 6 policies instead of 5, because I wanted Tradition to look like a pyramid.

This is just copy-pasted from a text document with a lot of tabs and spaces to line things up (because I didn't feel like opening up my diagramming tools). I'm not going to add fancy formatting, this is just to give you an idea of what goes on in my head. If I ever do get around to making this mod, I'd make proper charts for players. If someone wants to make this first, go right ahead.

While I know that policies have 5x3 coordinate space, I don't know yet if a policy's icon takes up more than 1x1 space, because no existing branches have more than 3 policies on the same depth.

Tradition vs. Assimilation

TRADITION (excess happiness added to culture)
[No requirement]
Pride (free culture building in first 4 cities)
/ \
Enthusiasm (+20% wonder production) Inheritance (-1 unhap,+1 g /2p in capital)
/ \ / \
Purpose Order (+1 production in every city) Salt of the Earth
(+1 happiness per city connected to capital) (+2 food in capital, +15% growth in all cities)
vs.
ASSIMILATION (other players' city-state influence degrades 20% faster)
[No requirement]
Wanderlust Second Home
(+1 science from trading posts) (+25% bonus when fighting in friendly territory)
| / |
Disapora (-50% consumption by specialist) Integration (-20% policy costs)
| \ |
Homecoming Reassertion
(-33% unhappiness in unoccupied cities) (+1 culture per city)


Liberty vs. Obedience

LIBERTY (faster border expansion, +3 culture from capital)
[No requirement]
Cooperation (+25% worker) Ambition (50% settler) Innovation (1 free tech)
\ / \ /
Vigilance (+100% garrison) Entrepreneurship (+1 gold per trade route)
\ /
Inalienable Rights (10 turn golden age, free great person)
vs.
OBEDIENCE (free promotion +1 movement)
[No requirement]
Slavery (+20% building rate) Loyalty (-25% unhappiness in unoccupied cities)
| |
Conscription (unit purchase -33%) Nationalization (-25% purchase cost)
| |
Police State (-50% unhappines in occupied cities) Bribery (gold gifts +50% influence)


Honor vs. Cunning

HONOR (+15% strength for adjacent unit)
[No requirement]
Militia Warrior Culture Heroism
(+25% vs./reveal barbarians) (culture from kills) (great general)
| | |
Professionalism Warrior Pride Tenacity
(double XP) (+1 happiness per garrison) (+25% when damaged)
vs.
CUNNING (free promotion: +1 sight)
[Classical Era]
Worldly Subversive
(Reveal all capitals, min CS level 10) (others CS decay 33% faster)
| / \
| Recruitment Diffusion
| (CS great people) (+33% from CS science)
| (+10% great people) (+3 science in capital)
\ / |
Efficient Meritorious
(+100% strategic resources) (-50% unhappiness from specialists)


Piety vs. Rationalism

PIETY (-20% policy cost from cities)
[Medieval Era]
Prayer Belief Zeal Service Sacrifice
(+1 production)(+2 happiness)(+25% great people)(-33% golden age cost)(-20% maintenance)
\ \ | / /
Transcendance
(Doubles golden age length, start 5 turn golden age; works out to be 10 due to other policy effect)
vs.
RATIONALISM (+15% science while happy)
[Renaissance Era]
Peer Review (+2 science/specialist)
/ \
Studious (+1 happiness/university, lab) Enlightenment (+1 science/city, 10 turn G.A.)
\ /
Scientific Revolution (3 free techs)
(Currently a diamond because I'm trying to figure out how to best make it look like a double-helix. Obviously diamond is weird - but also with only 4 policies, it gives science-focused civs a shot at switching to a culture victory.)


Freedom vs. Autocracy (Renamed Sovereignty vs. Dominion)

SOVEREIGNTY (+1 happiness/luxury)
[Renaissance Era]
Integrity (+33% city defense) Independence (+1 culture/specialist)
\ /
Constitution (double culture for Wonder)
/ | \
Suffrage Autonomy Freedom
(-33% policy cost from cities) (-33% road maintenance) (2 free policies)
vs.
DOMINION (-33% unit supply costs)
[Medieval Era]
Debtors (+20% gold in capital) Patronage (-50% CS decay)
| \ (+1 gold per 2 pop in capital)
| \ / |
Acquisition Occupation Vassalage
(-25% tile buy) (double resouces from CS) (min. influence is 25)
(+50% strategic resources) (+1 naval movement)
\ | /
Conquest (all military gain +50% for 20 turns)

[markusbeutel]

What the heck, here's the revised policies I'd like, but am currently too lazy to try modding. Every policy branch has a specific opposing branch. Of note, Patronage an Commerce are gone. Their effects are worked into other policies; also, most CS-related policies have a secondary non-CS-related effect, so that they're useful even in games without city-states. And, each branch has 6 policies instead of 5, because I wanted Tradition to look like a pyramid.

This is just copy-pasted from a text document with a lot of tabs and spaces to line things up (because I didn't feel like opening up my diagramming tools). I'm not going to add fancy formatting, this is just to give you an idea of what goes on in my head. If I ever do get around to making this mod, I'd make proper charts for players. If someone wants to make this first, go right ahead.

While I know that policies have 5x3 coordinate space, I don't know yet if a policy's icon takes up more than 1x1 space, because no existing branches have more than 3 policies on the same depth.

Tradition vs. Assimilation

TRADITION (excess happiness added to culture)
[No requirement]
Pride (free culture building in first 4 cities)
/ \
Enthusiasm (+20% wonder production) Inheritance (-1 unhap,+1 g /2p in capital)
/ \ / \
Purpose Order (+1 production in every city) Salt of the Earth
(+1 happiness per city connected to capital) (+2 food in capital, +15% growth in all cities)
vs.
ASSIMILATION (other players' city-state influence degrades 20% faster)
[No requirement]
Wanderlust Second Home
(+1 science from trading posts) (+25% bonus when fighting in friendly territory)
| / |
Disapora (-50% consumption by specialist) Integration (-20% policy costs)
| \ |
Homecoming Reassertion
(-33% unhappiness in unoccupied cities) (+1 culture per city)


Liberty vs. Obedience

LIBERTY (faster border expansion, +3 culture from capital)
[No requirement]
Cooperation (+25% worker) Ambition (50% settler) Innovation (1 free tech)
\ / \ /
Vigilance (+100% garrison) Entrepreneurship (+1 gold per trade route)
\ /
Inalienable Rights (10 turn golden age, free great person)
vs.
OBEDIENCE (free promotion +1 movement)
[No requirement]
Slavery (+20% building rate) Loyalty (-25% unhappiness in unoccupied cities)
| |
Conscription (unit purchase -33%) Nationalization (-25% purchase cost)
| |
Police State (-50% unhappines in occupied cities) Bribery (gold gifts +50% influence)


Honor vs. Cunning

HONOR (+15% strength for adjacent unit)
[No requirement]
Militia Warrior Culture Heroism
(+25% vs./reveal barbarians) (culture from kills) (great general)
| | |
Professionalism Warrior Pride Tenacity
(double XP) (+1 happiness per garrison) (+25% when damaged)
vs.
CUNNING (free promotion: +1 sight)
[Classical Era]
Worldly Subversive
(Reveal all capitals, min CS level 10) (others CS decay 33% faster)
| / \
| Recruitment Diffusion
| (CS great people) (+33% from CS science)
| (+10% great people) (+3 science in capital)
\ / |
Efficient Meritorious
(+100% strategic resources) (-50% unhappiness from specialists)


Piety vs. Rationalism

PIETY (-20% policy cost from cities)
[Medieval Era]
Prayer Belief Zeal Service Sacrifice
(+1 production)(+2 happiness)(+25% great people)(-33% golden age cost)(-20% maintenance)
\ \ | / /
Transcendance
(Doubles golden age length, start 5 turn golden age; works out to be 10 due to other policy effect)
vs.
RATIONALISM (+15% science while happy)
[Renaissance Era]
Peer Review (+2 science/specialist)
/ \
Studious (+1 happiness/university, lab) Enlightenment (+1 science/city, 10 turn G.A.)
\ /
Scientific Revolution (3 free techs)
(Currently a diamond because I'm trying to figure out how to best make it look like a double-helix. Obviously diamond is weird - but also with only 4 policies, it gives science-focused civs a shot at switching to a culture victory.)


Freedom vs. Autocracy (Renamed Sovereignty vs. Dominion)

SOVEREIGNTY (+1 happiness/luxury)
[Renaissance Era]
Integrity (+33% city defense) Independence (+1 culture/specialist)
\ /
Constitution (double culture for Wonder)
/ | \
Suffrage Autonomy Freedom
(-33% policy cost from cities) (-33% road maintenance) (2 free policies)
vs.
DOMINION (-33% unit supply costs)
[Medieval Era]
Debtors (+20% gold in capital) Patronage (-50% CS decay)
| \ (+1 gold per 2 pop in capital)
| \ / |
Acquisition Occupation Vassalage
(-25% tile buy) (double resouces from CS) (min. influence is 25)
(+50% strategic resources) (+1 naval movement)
\ | /
Conquest (all military gain +50% for 20 turns)

Some nice thinking outside of the box here. It's also completely moddable if you wanted to implement something that looks like this. In my NiGHTS mod I've trimmed the amount of Branches to 7 - there are 6 policies at the top of each Branch shaping a pyramid, and then there's 15 policies below that in a rectangle shape. It's all rather easy to mod, just a little tedious as you try and line things up properly. But there are not limits to depth or orientation - you can control placement down to the decimal point. Also, you are able to adjust the size of the icons/policy boxes very easily. I've increased them slightly in my mod. If you ever attempt to create this mod I'd be interested in trying it out. Good luck.

[dukeisaac]

I like that a lot AeEsBii, I was thinking myself that policies (or whatever) should offer more sine qua non options, meaning that they should be in competition and evolve through time, exactly like you put them. Therefore you would take a different path throughout each playthrough, there would be no problem of overbalancing policies (say everyone goes liberty cuz its too good) and it would be more emersive than simple linear unlock trade = get new policy or civic like in CiV. Really like that idea, hope the developpers have an ear to the ground with this.