Legions - How to use them

[Zefelius]

Originally Posted by Grayson

Actually, one of my new favorite things to do with the Germans, especially in games where the unit promotion scheme looks to be too slow, is to do a legion rush. Or even if I'm doing the unit promotion scheme, I'll start spamming legions out of 3-4 cities, especially with cities with 3 forests, because that's a legion army in 4 turns out of those cities. It's easy to go ahead and take down some close cities really early in the game, instead of waiting for knights. It's not always the best call, but the Germans can do a lot of things with that production, but you have to make the call based on the map.

I read this comment yesterday and the more I think about it the more I think you're right. If the Germans are already pretty slow techers, but they have awesome prod, and the traditional way of beating someone who is winning the tech race is by pressing them, then it seems like the Germans better do this before it's too late. I haven't used them in a while, but I'm starting to think that next time around I'm not going to build that ever-so-tempting barracks before 5 techs. It takes so much money from expansion, and since having even just two or three elite mid-game knights or tanks can be great, there may not be an overriding reason to try to produce 6 or 7. Plus, if you win some of those legion battles, one or two of them might turn elite as well...

[sdu754]

Originally Posted by ninja_master

well this thread im pretty sure was to show u SHOULD use legions. im sure more people use them now esp as romans or indians. basically theyre main use is a cheap(10 hammers) strong(vet army=9) spam unit. because u catch a player off guard, tht army can take a city tht may only have an archer. its very easy to spam a city with legion armies if you have a few forest/hills/resources.

how is archer<legion? they have different uses. and knights are good for attackin since they leave a city after attacking and only have a measly 2(army 6) defense. use catapults.

I switch to archers as the main unit I produce after Warriors, because I think warriors aren't all that good. I actually usually play long games and usually go from initial warriors, then archers (as a way to defend cities), then catapults. After that you could skip knights and then go to cannons if you want, then tanks.

Basically You would build archers as soon as you get Bronze Working in & stop producing warriors.

[harrold]

great thread morte... i always considered legions a trash unit. i rarely see anyone use them.

[Alitaba66]

This may be a st00pid question, but do people actually use legions anymore? I was reading this thread and while it all seems reasonable there are some obvious difficulties with trying a legion rush... mainly the need for ships to transport and archers to defend them as well as risking falling way behind in tech if you arent successful in taking a few cities early.

Also, thinking back over the past year or so I can honestly say I have never... and I mean NEVER... faced an opponent that rushed legions... maybe I just have been lucky but I'd thought I'd ask if you all are still using this strat. And is it mainly a FFA or H2H strat?

And if so which civ's do you prefer the legion rush with these days... still germans and romans and arabs? how about indians? or greeks?

thanks

[danthechan]

where i could see legions working good is on those 2 or more tile islands where they have single archers defending. a turn ending galleon swoop with a couple armies and that city is yours. although i like to protect with archers you really don't need them in these cases. islands are rarely ready to counter attack.

[TyShine]

Originally Posted by Alitaba66

This may be a st00pid question, but do people actually use legions anymore? I was reading this thread and while it all seems reasonable there are some obvious difficulties with trying a legion rush... mainly the need for ships to transport and archers to defend them as well as risking falling way behind in tech if you arent successful in taking a few cities early.

Also, thinking back over the past year or so I can honestly say I have never... and I mean NEVER... faced an opponent that rushed legions... maybe I just have been lucky but I'd thought I'd ask if you all are still using this strat. And is it mainly a FFA or H2H strat?

And if so which civ's do you prefer the legion rush with these days... still germans and romans and arabs? how about indians? or greeks?

thanks

I will use an old quote from Morte, "maybe when you understand how to use legions you will understand how to play.", or something like that. If you want I can go into detail about their various uses, but not at the moment.

[dukeblue1987]

Originally Posted by TyShine

I will use an old quote from Morte, "maybe when you understand how to use legions you will understand how to play.", or something like that. If you want I can go into detail about their various uses, but not at the moment.

HAHA so true. Sometimes I feel like I'm the only one who uses them. I guess it's from the lack of competition in ranked matches. They are so versatile its sick.

[Grayson]

Originally Posted by Alitaba66

This may be a st00pid question, but do people actually use legions anymore? I was reading this thread and while it all seems reasonable there are some obvious difficulties with trying a legion rush... mainly the need for ships to transport and archers to defend them as well as risking falling way behind in tech if you arent successful in taking a few cities early.

Also, thinking back over the past year or so I can honestly say I have never... and I mean NEVER... faced an opponent that rushed legions... maybe I just have been lucky but I'd thought I'd ask if you all are still using this strat. And is it mainly a FFA or H2H strat?

And if so which civ's do you prefer the legion rush with these days... still germans and romans and arabs? how about indians? or greeks?

thanks

yes, legions are still very very useful. This thread isn't that old. Only a few months old.

Did you ever think to yourself "If I only had one more horsearmy" or run into a "wall" while rushing early? Or know that the other guy isn't building units, but just teching up?

Iron Working is cheap, and legions are dirt cheap. Yes, it can take some time to get a legion rush working, but if you take a city with them, that's like gaining 2 cities, one for yourself, and one from your enemy. It can also be looked at as a two city swing if you save one of your own cities by using them for counter attacks.

Building legions instead of archers if often the better call. Oftentimes when people rush others, they send an army over to a city, and then if they see that the odds won't be in their favor, they'll retreat right away, and don't expect a counter attack, figuring that there are just archers there. Or they'll attack and get wounded, but just heal right in front of a city. If you have a legion army there, you can kill hor☺☺☺☺☺, warriors, and knights with equal or better odds. They can keep you safe.

With galleons, they are a great early attacking force. A vet galleon w/ vet legion army is 10.5 attack. A vet galleon fleet with a vet legion army is 13.5 attack. If you have multiple armies, they just can't stop you most of the time.

It's ok to stop teching to build the legions. If you take a city from the tech leader, you'll be taking his tech anyway. If you threaten the other guy, you will slow them down plenty to catch back up in teching.

I don't use legions in every game. Maybe not even in half of my games, but they have so many uses, and hardly anyone uses them or expects them, which makes them perfect for winning a lot of games. I can't tell you how many lost games I've had where I decide to stick around to see if a last gasp legion rush will work, and it ends up paying off.

[Alitaba66]

Originally Posted by TyShine

I will use an old quote from Morte, "maybe when you understand how to use legions you will understand how to play.", or something like that. If you want I can go into detail about their various uses, but not at the moment.

hmmmm... to readdress my original query:

My question is whether or not people actually use legions on anything other than a once in a blue moon basis. What I mean is that if they are so versatile and dominating, why have I yet to see someone use them in a FFA game? Maybe its a strat that only comes out in very specific situations? Or maybe its boring so people don't use them anymore? I see players (including from this forum) horse rushing and knight rushing all the time... so it would seem that those are either more consistently effective strats OR easier and therefore more likely to be used?

I see the potential for counter attacking invading armies, ship dropping on island cities or poorly defended caps, or spamming a bunch as described in this thread.... I was more interested in why people seem not to use them more often....

Perhaps this is a question that is not answerable...

[Alitaba66]

Originally Posted by Grayson

yes, legions are still very very useful. This thread isn't that old. Only a few months old.

Did you ever think to yourself "If I only had one more horsearmy" or run into a "wall" while rushing early? Or know that the other guy isn't building units, but just teching up?

Iron Working is cheap, and legions are dirt cheap. Yes, it can take some time to get a legion rush working, but if you take a city with them, that's like gaining 2 cities, one for yourself, and one from your enemy. It can also be looked at as a two city swing if you save one of your own cities by using them for counter attacks.

Building legions instead of archers if often the better call. Oftentimes when people rush others, they send an army over to a city, and then if they see that the odds won't be in their favor, they'll retreat right away, and don't expect a counter attack, figuring that there are just archers there. Or they'll attack and get wounded, but just heal right in front of a city. If you have a legion army there, you can kill hor☺☺☺☺☺, warriors, and knights with equal or better odds. They can keep you safe.

With galleons, they are a great early attacking force. A vet galleon w/ vet legion army is 10.5 attack. A vet galleon fleet with a vet legion army is 13.5 attack. If you have multiple armies, they just can't stop you most of the time.

It's ok to stop teching to build the legions. If you take a city from the tech leader, you'll be taking his tech anyway. If you threaten the other guy, you will slow them down plenty to catch back up in teching.

I don't use legions in every game. Maybe not even in half of my games, but they have so many uses, and hardly anyone uses them or expects them, which makes them perfect for winning a lot of games. I can't tell you how many lost games I've had where I decide to stick around to see if a last gasp legion rush will work, and it ends up paying off.

Thanks... this was the sort of answer I was looking for. I may try this next as I think I have gotten the hang of MadDjinn's greek strat... which civ is a good one to practice the legion rush strat as?