Will I see myself in a mirror?

[Rapture_Tourist]

I think I have seen mirrors in the E3 demo - will we see our ingame avatar and maybe even how Plasmids have altered him? Or are our hands the only graphical feedback?

[ertertwert]

I guess it depends if there is going to be body awareness or not.

[Necros]

I guess it depends if there is going to be body awareness or not.
I think it's not related to that. But if I remember correctly this was asked earlier and someone said we can't see ourselves in mirrors. :confused: But I may be wrong, and I hope I am. :D

[jackinthebox]

I guess it depends if there is going to be body awareness or not.

i also think it isn't related to the mirrors... for example: Duke Nukem 3D. There were also mirrors where you could see yourself, but body awareness wasn't implemented.

[Pinstripe]

There probably will be mirrors, but they'll be either broken or dirty or steamy so that you can't precisely see yourself....I always prefer it that way actually.

[Necros]

There probably will be mirrors, but they'll be either broken or dirty or steamy so that you can't precisely see yourself....I always prefer it that way actually.
:confused: Why? I can't understand it. Just like the dumb mute main characters...

[Pinstripe]

:confused: Why? I can't understand it. Just like the dumb mute main characters...
But that's the point of the whole game, playing a character you assume, not some dress puppet a'la D&D. Like In System Shock 2, you don't have a voice or any characteristics that could spoil the PC. Therefor, it's unnecessary to know how the PC actually looks like.

[Maniac]

I'm sure the water will probably be reflective.

-Maniac

[Necros]

But that's the point of the whole game, playing a character you assume, not some dress puppet a'la D&D. Like In System Shock 2, you don't have a voice or any characteristics that could spoil the PC. Therefor, it's unnecessary to know how the PC actually looks like.
Immersion works better for me, if I know how I look and sound like in the game. Like in Deus Ex or in Wizardry 8 for example. I like interaction with other chatacters and it's kinda bad if my char is mute. :( If you can choose how you sound and/or look like, it's even better.
I'm not playing myself, I'm playing a charcter. And it's good to know as much about him/her as possible, so I can put myself in the chatacter's shoes easier.

If I can't see/hear the character I'm playing, I can't care much about him/her. It's like I'm just looking through a camera not a person's eyes, because that way it has no personality or at least not much.

[Pinstripe]

Well this won't be your game then, my friend!

[Necros]

Well this won't be your game then, my friend!
I trust IG, they can create a world that makes you feel like you are really there. They can overcome this thing.

Didn't you like Garrett or JC? I think it adds to the gameplay if you are playing a character because it's more interesting.

[Flash Johnson]

garrett's voice is brilliant.

remember their dynamic help system, i think they might implement character voice in that by having your character think to himself

[redrain85]

I really hope we do get a chance to see our character's reflection at least once, even if it's distorted (reflection in a metal surface, a broken mirror, etc). While the character's hands are an obvious indicator of how mutated you're becoming, just one key moment where you get to see what you've become would be great.

[Renight]

That would be perfect, like, if you killed a bunch of little sisters during the game, you would be all bloodied up. Well actually, you would be bloodied up from killing anything.

[Hatesink]

garrett's voice is brilliant.

remember their dynamic help system, i think they might implement character voice in that by having your character think to himselfCoC:DCotE had voiced descriptions of a huge amount of in-game items and it really seemed to add a lot to the game. After playing it and moving on to a new game I found myself habitually wanting to access descriptions of more or less every artifact in that new game, and without the descriptions the environment felt really sparse. It's surprising the difference it makes.

I'd love to see plenty of that kind of vocal description. If the player-character mused to himself about the various effects and uses of the Plasmids it'd just be that much more brilliant (at least in my opinion).

I'd definitely like to see vocal descriptions implemented, maybe with the option to switch it off on the game configuration screen, for those that would just prefer not to have it.

[Hatesink]

I hope so— but I wonder if we'll be surprised by what it shows us...

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/7549/reflectionjy0.jpg

:p

Maybe it'll look something like the portrait of Dorian Gray :eek:

[Raveness]

I thought we are essentially playing ourselves in this game, a silent character ala Gordon Freeman, and not a character with a voice.

I like to escape into my games, the most I expect to hear is some male grunting and the sight of meaty hands holding the weapons, both easily dismissed. I certainly don't want to hear a male-only voice having an inner monologue describing his ventures in Rapture if such characterization is meaningless.

[Da Bubs]

I thought we are essentially playing ourselves in this game, a silent character ala Gordon Freeman, and not a character with a voice.



that was my understanding too. Even if they could talk there really isnt very many people to talk to are there? your not going to ask a splicer where the bathroom is, if there is any two way conversations it think it will be your standard RPG thing like in oblivion.

[Silverback]

:confused: Why? I can't understand it. Just like the dumb mute main characters...
There usually broken, steamed or dirty to hide the fact that a model was never created for the avatar. Reducing polys, as you know, increases performance.

IMO, I can do without an avatar model because I like to think it's me anyway and not some pre-defined character like I do in all games I play.

(Except Jenna J.'s latest game... in that little adventure I'm the camera man!)

[jovialjester]

Personally i like to hear some sort of voice. I think it just adds to the experiance. You can immerse yourself into that character. As for the seeing myself in the mirror...it would be great to see the plasmids working on you, however its not a major aspect i care for. Anything to help immerse yourself farther into the game would be excellent.

[Soulsphere]

Although I think it would be interesting to see the player as the character mutates, I also am forced to agree with Raveness. Assuming that you're suppose to be the main character, can you really fully escape into the game if you're a male player playing a female character? Or vice versa?

A way around this is if the game allowed a selection for the character's sex. I don't see this as a problem if the main character does not have much, if any dialogue. However, how many games give you the option of selecting the gender of your character?

[Raveness]

I don't mind getting a nameless, soulless, voiceless male or female character if the developers are strapped for time in making further options. However, I would like some my-newt attempt at characterizing the player's role if they choose that route. Valve gave a little bit to Gordon via his reputation among people he talked to, and that's enough for me. It enhances immersion and grounds the player's perspective in the fictional world.

What I don't want to see, and what Irrational has done before in SS2, is to create an avatar, sticking it to one form, keeping it voiceless & soulless, just for the purpose of the cinematics. They could have easily kept the cutscenes in the first-person perspective, leaving us to guess at his appearance.

[AuspexAO]

What was the avatar character's only line in SS2? Wasn't it "Nah" in response to SHODAN's offer of alliance? That did kind of blow the immersion. Especially because the avatar looked like he should be playing disc in Tron rather than serving on the Rickenbacker.

[aids on wheels]

i think he should talk a bit
but not much to keep the player immersed in the game
but he'll have to say something i mean he isn't just going to walk into a world he has never seen and not yell once if someone's there
he's going to stay silent when he sees the first splicer (wich looks like a normal human at first sight?

[BioShockWins]

we can use our forum avatar as our face...


*looks around*
o.O

[Kelan]

Sex choice may be advisable for more complete immersion in gamers of both sexes if the nameless character is represented only by hands and a few sound effects. I know that my wife, at least, is highly interested.

[v.dog]

You can have androgenous hands and grunts (depending on how masculine/feminine you want the character to be). Personally I think skin tone is a bigger issue- What if I want to be a black guy? Or Asian, Indian, Middle Eastern?

[MF9000]

You can have androgenous hands and grunts (depending on how masculine/feminine you want the character to be). Personally I think skin tone is a bigger issue- What if I want to be a black guy? Or Asian, Indian, Middle Eastern?

Mod it? :D

[Morovir]

My personal opinion:

1) seeing your avatar in the mirror isn't that big a deal. However; having working mirrors can add a lot to the game. Imagine looking at the damage to your body in a mirror, only to see a bad guy behind you.

Moveable, placeable mirrors could be VERY cool for surveillance, and if you are going to use it for that, you might as well be able to see yourself.

2) Character voice would depend on whether there is anyone, or anything, to talk with. If there isn't, I don't want stupid voice-overs. If there are, then I'd limit it to those conversations. It sounds like there won't be that many opportunities to talk anyway.

The key is to not harm immersion.

[Nihil]

I hope you can see urself in mirrors and such for the sake of realism and nothing else cause i don't need complete charachter immersion to feel like i'm there and i'm him kinda thing just realism cause i'm sorry most people when they look down can see there feet unless there fat then maybe atleast there gut haha i don't care if the character doesn't actually talk outloud or not but i do hope there is dialog between you and other ai's maybe even choice dialog similiar to oblivion but with better ai and such.

[K3NNy]

I think it's not related to that. But if I remember correctly this was asked earlier and someone said we can't see ourselves in mirrors. :confused: But I may be wrong, and I hope I am. :D

You can't see yourself because the main character is actually a vampire, and as we all no from vampire lore, vampires have no reflections!

[Ectoplasm]

Like In System Shock 2, you don't have a voice or any characteristics that could spoil the PC. Therefor, it's unnecessary to know how the PC actually looks like.Actually, the very beginning of SS2 has a video showing PC stumbling out of the healing chamber. So you get to see yourself in 'full glory'.

Mirrors are a simple thing to implement, and I am 100% sure that Rapture is loaded with mirrors so its highly individualistic citizens could admire themselves. To have all of them broken would be strange, so I think we'll be seeing the PC in them. And it'll be either a single model ala NOLF, or a chosen one ala Deus Ex 2. I doubt there will be a tweak system like in Oblivion, but PC version will probably have player skin mods galore. I am looking forward to playing Bx as Paris Hilton. :D

[Newbeing]

Would be funny if all the mirrors in the game were so filthy/ broken you could only see small parts of yourself, that is until the very end when a beautiful mirror shows how grotesque you have become.

[Ectoplasm]

Also consider:
1. Rapture is underwater.
2. Lots of walls are made of glass.
3. Deep sea is fairly dark.

What do you see if you look at a glass wall that has water behind it - especially if it is dark on the other side?

[lurchibald]

Also consider:
1. Rapture is underwater.
2. Lots of walls are made of glass.
3. Deep sea is fairly dark.

What do you see if you look at a glass wall that has water behind it - especially if it is dark on the other side?

Haiku anyone? :D

[Kill the BDs]

maybe youre invicible, eh?

[cdstacker]

i hope there is at least one mirror, perhaps towards the end of the game there is one massive one, that way if you've abused plasmids you can see the monster you've become.

[Nias Wolf]

Well, as people said, there were probably a lot of mirrors in Rapture. But I think it would be understandable, from a story logic standpoint, if the citizens disposed of most of the mirrors. For the same reason that they wear masks. They would not want to look at the monsters they had become. But then agian, their is a lot of dark glass/pools of water... and I'm sure some people would still keep mirrors... Would it really be that complicated to have the player see their own reflection? :rolleyes:

[Metal-Geo]

Quite honestly, I like how it was done in F.E.A.R. Anyone played that? :P

Basically, you have no name, barely any identity and history but you are still special. And with reflections, you were only able to see half of yourself in several water reflections. And it was done in a particular way that you upper body was too black to even see the details (and thus making you unable to see your face).

It's one of those details that make me smirk. :)

[K3NNy]

^^^ That does sound pretty cool :D

[gains]

I'm fine with a faceless, mute character, so long as you don't have chatty allies.

Much as I love her, Alyx gets on my nerves with her one-sided conversation. I now make up things to say aloud while playing to avoid those awkward silences after her wry observations, bad puns, and displays of concern.

[Metal-Geo]

Alyx was indeed a big chatterbox. I did like here lame sense of humor in Episode Two though. (The Zombine comment, for instance, when she fails to find it funny herself) Made me just say "haha, you suck..." out loud.

But I think in Bioshock, you're pretty much alone on the job.

[Psyclone]

I'm fine with a faceless, mute character, so long as you don't have chatty allies.

Much as I love her, Alyx gets on my nerves with her one-sided conversation. I now make up things to say aloud while playing to avoid those awkward silences after her wry observations, bad puns, and displays of concern.

That was the thing that most bugged me about Half-life 2. But it wasn't exclusive to Alyx:

"Hey look everybody! It's Gordon Freeman!"
"..."
"At last, Freeman is going to lead the way to victory!"
"..."
"I would ask you where you've been all these years, but I'll leave that to some other time. TO ARMS!"
"..."

My disbelief can only take so much.

[poopypooperson]

That was the thing that most bugged me about Half-life 2. But it wasn't exclusive to Alyx:

"Hey look everybody! It's Gordon Freeman!"
"..."
"At last, Freeman is going to lead the way to victory!"
"..."
"I would ask you where you've been all these years, but I'll leave that to some other time. TO ARMS!"
"..."

My disbelief can only take so much.What can you say, he's a modest guy! :D

[K3NNy]

What can you say, he's a modest guy! :D

Modest isn't the word. I think Gordon Freeman is always really intoxicated all the time and never quite knows what is going on around him. To the player and the NPCs he is saving the earth but to him he is just winning a lot of bar fights.

[Criscokilika]

Wow, this topic really got heated. I'm sure that if you look directly into a perfectly fine mirror you won't see the rest of the room without you.

[biohazzard]

maybe if its steamed or broken it can just hide the face so you can just see
arms maybe hand hair if he has any.
for the voice thing he moans and stuff when hes hurt

[biohazzard]

edit he moans and stuff when hes hurt doesnt he

[Nias Wolf]

Yes, the main character grunts if he gets hurt. I think. :rolleyes:

[biohazzard]

i meant getting hurt real bad like in the cutscene with the electrobolt plasmid