Bioshock and the Mind Contol theme (possible SPOILER)

[speed]

I don't think I've come across any threads or discussion on this, but apologize in advance if this is posted elsewhere.

The first time I came across the huge plot twist in Bioshock where you find out that you have been a victim of mind control (MC) all along I was quite surprised and curious. Also, I think the Big Daddys are under MC and the Splicers are as well via phermones. This is an area I have sort of been interested in and studied off and on for maybe the last dozen years or so.

I am just curious to know how many are aware that Mind Control methods are not a made up or fictional subject. In the game Tenenbaum mentioned experimentation that went on in the Nazi concentration camps in one of the audio diaries. Many believe that in reality a lot of these experiments had to do with MC, an application of this would be attempting to create "super soldiers" who would show no fear in combat and not retreat from battle, or spys that would have a photographic memory and would be unable to divulge secrets to the enemy if captured.

Through the Freedom of Information Act it is now known that MC experimentation continued in the US through projects such as MK Ultra. Don't take my word for it though there has been much research done on the subject and it is all available if you look for it.

Would you kindly reply if any of these things crossed your mind when you were playing? ;)

Thanks!

[samman6]

A man chooses a slave obeys. I always thought of the experiment where authority is never questioned and the victims are shocked just because the authority figure tells them to, i can't remember the name of the experiment. Anyways that is the type of mind control i think of when i think of bioshock, the idea of never questioning ones actions, just blindly following, this sheep mentality is what leads to oppresive governments and hardship. ALWAYS QUESTION YOUR ACTIONS

[Atlas.]

Very true. I see Mind Control as in Brain washing also. For example children living in Nazi Germany, forced to believe and follow the Nazi way of life without question, changing them to think the way they did. Maybe this is relevant (Bioshock being set not long after the end of WWII)? Doctors experimenting on Prisoners of War, then when the war is over and they get caught, they simply state they were doing it because they were told to, slaves to their masters i suppose...

"A man chooses, a slave obeys". A very strong line from Mr. Ryan, which certainly stands true

[speed]

"A man chooses, a slave obeys"

Yes! I almost forgot that line, thanks guys. Very revelant in re to mind control. It does show Ryan's elitist side doesn't it? MC is capable of removing free will from a person, even to the point where they aren't even aware that their will is no longer their own. Interesting thing is that an alternate personality (or many personalities) can be created in a mind. One personality in a person's mind for instance can be made to have no knowledge of any of the other personalities. This is very convenient for the handler/experimenter/controller etc. as you can imagine. The handler can establish post-hypnotic verbal or hand signal(s) and associate it with one of the personalities so that when said or shown will bring that personality to the front so to speak. This is the personality who then takes control and actually IS the person at that point. A different personality or "alter" can be moved to the front with a different cue.

Unfortunatley, I think Ryan is sort of correct with the quote above. A man subjected to full blown MC may have no choice but to obey and can become a slave of sorts, however, I don't think this makes him less of a man, just more of a victim.

[samman6]

"A man chooses, a slave obeys"

Yes! I almost forgot that line, thanks guys. Very revelant in re to mind control. It does show Ryan's elitist side doesn't it? MC is capable of removing free will from a person, even to the point where they aren't even aware that their will is no longer their own. Interesting thing is that an alternate personality (or many personalities) can be created in a mind. One personality in a person's mind for instance can be made to have no knowledge of any of the other personalities. This is very convenient for the handler/experimenter/controller etc. as you can imagine. The handler can establish post-hypnotic verbal or hand signal(s) and associate it with one of the personalities so that when said or shown will bring that personality to the front so to speak. This is the personality who then takes control and actually IS the person at that point. A different personality or "alter" can be moved to the front with a different cue.

Unfortunatley, I think Ryan is sort of correct with the quote above. A man subjected to full blown MC may have no choice but to obey and can become a slave of sorts, however, I don't think this makes him less of a man, just more of a victim.

That isn't exactly how i read the saying, but i can see your point. I read its meaning that "ignorance is bliss" almost, that if people are put under authority it gives them an excuse for their actions, "well he told me so" is a good example of this type of behavior. People who are not sheep wouldn't act with out questioning their actions first. People have to open their minds to the forces people undergo, control is everywhere in every media house to every government. WAKE UP PEOPLE, then you won't be enslaved.

[Venom Wolf]

I always thought of it as a warning against following authority blindly and not questioning everything.

Also, I found a comment on this in here:

http://www.destructoid.com/the-ten-most-meaningful-videogame-quotes-of-all-time-64837.phtml

An interesting read.

[speed]

I do agree with you guys (Venom and Sam). This is definitley one of the intended meanings of the message. Those who do not question but choose to blindly follow are simply looking to others to control them, not much better than a slave. A man is able to think for himself and steer his life as he feels is best. This is why Ryan had to get out from under the oppressive thumb of the government and corporate dictatorships that tried to tell him how to conduct his business.

I think Ryan is also making a bit of a stab at Jack with this line letting him know that he is indeed a slave and has no choice but to obey him due to the mind control he is under. This is what I was referring to in my previous post.

Such a thought-provoking game, that's one of the reasons Bioshock separates itself from all of the others :)