Civ Rev no longer for Wii

[mattappling]

IGN.com is reporting that the Wii, despite now having the largest installed user base, is getting shafted by Firaxis. Civilization Revolution development on the Wii has been halted. Why? No answer. I was really looking forward to this game, and I'm quite irritated now.

What's the problem here?

Who else is upset by this news?

[CherryIcee]

I was actually going to try out the Wii version (since I don't have any of the other consoles) so this is definitely disappointing. :(

[2K Elizabeth]

the article mentioned is here: http://wii.ign.com/articles/848/848144p1.html

[Jason2K]

IGN.com is reporting that the Wii, despite now having the largest installed user base, is getting shafted by Firaxis. Civilization Revolution development on the Wii has been halted. Why? No answer. I was really looking forward to this game, and I'm quite irritated now.

What's the problem here?

Unlike many other Wii versions of games, the plan for CivRev Wii was to do it in-house at Firaxis, just like the DS, 360 and PS3 versions of the game. Unfortunately we came to the conclusion that Firaxis didn't have the manpower to do four versions of the game simultaneously and we didn't want the quality loss that comes from licensing out a port, so it was put on hold.

That doesn't mean we won't revisit it in the future, just that right now, CivRev for Wii is on indefinite hiatus.

I know you were looking forward to the Wii version, and I'm sorry, but we'd rather not do it than do it and have it not stand up to the other versions of the game (or worse, have all four versions be lower quality because of it).

[dojoboy]

Unlike many other Wii versions of games, the plan for CivRev Wii was to do it in-house at Firaxis, just like the DS, 360 and PS3 versions of the game. Unfortunately we came to the conclusion that Firaxis didn't have the manpower to do four versions of the game simultaneously and we didn't want the quality loss that comes from licensing out a port, so it was put on hold.

Right, but it was already coming out 4-6 mos. later than the other three versions. It's got to be more than a manpower issue, like something more lucrative. I'm really bummed about not having a Wii version. :mad:

I do have a DS, so I'm not left out in the cold.

And [disclaimer: I'm no industry insider], I'd have to imagine that a Wii version of CivRev is going to sell more copies than 360 and PS3. :confused:

[fortunzfavor]

Unlike many other Wii versions of games, the plan for CivRev Wii was to do it in-house at Firaxis, just like the DS, 360 and PS3 versions of the game. Unfortunately we came to the conclusion that Firaxis didn't have the manpower to do four versions of the game simultaneously and we didn't want the quality loss that comes from licensing out a port, so it was put on hold.

That doesn't mean we won't revisit it in the future, just that right now, CivRev for Wii is on indefinite hiatus.

I know you were looking forward to the Wii version, and I'm sorry, but we'd rather not do it than do it and have it not stand up to the other versions of the game (or worse, have all four versions be lower quality because of it).

FYI, this game was my most anticipated Wii game of the year--yes even though Fit, Brawl, Kart and maybe even Red Steel 2 are on the docket. I was really grateful that you guys were taking steps to support Wii, even though it was scheduled months later than the others (not exactly "simultaneous"). I gotta tell you, that goodwill is out the window. The idea that you're supporting the PS3 right out of the window but the Wii will potentially never get it?

I'm not ignorant of the general 3rd party attitude towards Wii, that you don't think there are enough hardcore players on the system to buy your games, but a fair look at the record shows good hardcore games do well, and the crashes and burns are all poorly ported rushed titles. We're both looking at the same evidence, but all around me I hear Wii owners begging for decent hardcore games. And you guys chose the pathetic PS3 userbase instead. I don't doubt they'll get bigger, maybe make a run for 1st someday--but it won't happen before you release this game, and you won't generate nearly the goodwill there that would have if you'd filled a massive hole in the Wii lineup.

A fair look at the lifecycle of the DS, back when it had the same 3rd party/hardcore problems the Wii does now, should tell you that now is a great time to be hard at work on Wii titles, and it's not really a bad time to be delaying PS3 titles.

Massive Fail Firaxis. Massive. :mad:

[dojoboy]

The real problem is, I gather from reading interviews w/ Sid, is that Sid is infatuated w/ the 360. :(

We need to send him a Wii. :D

At least in terms of how his mind filtered his early choices.

[dojoboy]

Here's an interesting post.

CFC thread on CivRev cancellation on the Wii (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=6426502&postcount=11)

[Jason2K]

I gotta tell you, that goodwill is out the window. The idea that you're supporting the PS3 right out of the window but the Wii will potentially never get it?

I pointed this out over at CivFanatics, so I might as well post it here as well...

It's not as simple as us supporting PS3 instead of Wii.

The lead platform for CivRev is 360. The PS3 version, while not a snap by any means, can at least use the same engine and assets as the 360 version. It is a comparatively small team working on the PS3 version of CivRev.

For the Wii, we can't just do that. We have to use a lower-end graphics engine and scale all the assets down to meet the platform's lower requirements. It's not impossible, but it is time consuming, and Firaxis doesn't have the manpower to do it to anyone's satisfaction while developing the other three versions of the game, plus other unannounced projects in various states of development.

[dojoboy]

I pointed this out over at CivFanatics, so I might as well post it here as well...

It's not as simple as us supporting PS3 instead of Wii.

The lead platform for CivRev is 360. The PS3 version, while not a snap by any means, can at least use the same engine and assets as the 360 version. It is a comparatively small team working on the PS3 version of CivRev.

For the Wii, we can't just do that. We have to use a lower-end graphics engine and scale all the assets down to meet the platform's lower requirements. It's not impossible, but it is time consuming, and Firaxis doesn't have the manpower to do it to anyone's satisfaction while developing the other three versions of the game, plus other unannounced projects in various states of development.

We hear ya Jason. It's just... bad for us.

What about the group that helped w/ one of Civ4's expansions?

[BioShockWins]

You also need to consider how game budgeting works.

Bad games aren't made, well, bad because the people who made them are bad at making games, it's (usually) because the developers need to sacrifice one thing in their time/budget continuum to make something else better. Which sometimes makes the game live UNDER it's full potential.

I can't think of any good examples at the moment, but because of how much longer a Wii version would have taken, the time/budget thing would have been "broken".

That's just my theory, and doesn't (necessarily) have anything to do with this instance specifically.

EDIT: Although I'd love a Wii version of Civ.
Now I have to get ALL the consoles... Jerks... (JK)

[fortunzfavor]

I pointed this out over at CivFanatics, so I might as well post it here as well...

It's not as simple as us supporting PS3 instead of Wii.


Fair point, but I'm going to have to hate the company anyway. It's not personal. It's business.

You may feel free to re-earn my rather long-lived affection (since the days of Alpha Centauri--still one of my favorites (and long overdue for a sequel, FYI)) by convincing 2K (or Nintendo for that matter) to shell out investment to hire new personnel or partially outsource Wii development. I appreciate that you decided not to issue shovelware with Civ Rev stamped on it, but even with some outsourcing, your primary firaxis crew could approve/polish the final product after the primary versions were finished.

As to your other projects, I have no sympathy for them. I want my civ, and I want it on Wii. :(

[dojoboy]

Fair point, but I'm going to have to hate the company anyway. It's not personal. It's business.


:chuckle:

Can I still buy the DS version and hate them at the same time?

[Modeltrainman]

Unlike many other Wii versions of games, the plan for CivRev Wii was to do it in-house at Firaxis, just like the DS, 360 and PS3 versions of the game. Unfortunately we came to the conclusion that Firaxis didn't have the manpower to do four versions of the game simultaneously and we didn't want the quality loss that comes from licensing out a port, so it was put on hold.

That doesn't mean we won't revisit it in the future, just that right now, CivRev for Wii is on indefinite hiatus.

I know you were looking forward to the Wii version, and I'm sorry, but we'd rather not do it than do it and have it not stand up to the other versions of the game (or worse, have all four versions be lower quality because of it). Do you work for Firaxis, Jason2K? If you do, could you tell them that a PSP version of Civ Rev would be appriciated, (and ask them about a new patch for Sid Meier's Railroads!)

[2K Elizabeth]

Do you work for Firaxis, Jason2K? If you do, could you tell them that a PSP version of Civ Rev would be appriciated, (and ask them about a new patch for Sid Meier's Railroads!)

both jason and i work for 2K and work closely with Firaxis. jason is actually the producer for Civilization Revolution (and all other Civ games!) and knows more about the company and game than you could ever believe.

[fortunzfavor]

:chuckle:

Can I still buy the DS version and hate them at the same time?

Yes, of course. But there's a spitting and cussing requirement each time you turn on the game. If you don't cuss, spit twice in heavy derision. ;)

I was pretty disappointed in the early screenshots for the DS version. I'm not particularly wooed by gfx, after all, I am a Wii owner, but hopefully (for your sake) there are improvements in the pipes. It seems like a great system for the game.

[dojoboy]

Yes, of course. But there's a spitting and cussing requirement each time you turn on the game. If you don't cuss, spit twice in heavy derision. ;)

Will do!

I was pretty disappointed in the early screenshots for the DS version. I'm not particularly wooed by gfx, after all, I am a Wii owner, but hopefully (for your sake) there are improvements in the pipes. It seems like a great system for the game.

I felt the same way, but having played Age of Kings, Zelda: Phantom Hour Glass, and now Advance Wars: Days of Ruin, I find that the art work takes on a presentation unique to the game system. And, as you mention, I imagine it'll get polished over the next 3 mos.

[fortunzfavor]

both jason and i work for 2K and work closely with Firaxis. jason is actually the producer for Civilization Revolution (and all other Civ games!) and knows more about the company and game than you could ever believe.

Does he know where the bodies are buried and would he be willing to use that to leverage the company into investing more heavily in alternate platforms for Civ Rev?

I felt the same way, but having played Age of Kings, Zelda: Phantom Hour Glass, and now Advance Wars: Days of Ruin, I find that the art work takes on a presentation unique to the game system. And, as you mention, I imagine it'll get polished over the next 3 mos.

I thought Zelda looked incredible, but I haven't viewed AoKs yet. When I read that the normally RTS mechanics went turn based, I got spooked. I love both play styles, but I don't really like franchises switching back and forth. It was probably outsourced anyway, so this wouldn't apply, but I like teams to stick with what they're good at.

[dojoboy]

I thought Zelda looked incredible, but I haven't viewed AoKs yet. When I read that the normally RTS mechanics went turn based, I got spooked. I love both play styles, but I don't really like franchises switching back and forth. It was probably outsourced anyway, so this wouldn't apply, but I like teams to stick with what they're good at.

I loved Zelda: PHG. It is one of the best games I've ever played. I just got a yellow lab puppy and named her Zelda. She's a real sweetie!

I like AoK. It is basically a classic TBS game on the DS but in the AOE direction - economy & war. Not deep, but very worthwhile on a road trip or in a waiting room.

[prateeko]

I'd blame Nintendo :p

But seriously. They said people don't want HD but I saw a recent article where they found 65% of Wii owners have a HD (66% of 360 owners and something like 75% of PS3 owners). Damn shame the Wii isn't in HD, it'd kick much more ass that way...

[Daninator]

I was very disappointed to hear that there might not be a Wii version; though I own a DS, I like playing multiplayer games with people beside me, and most of my friends don't have a DS; my boyfriend and I share our DS so we can't play with each other (even if we could, passing the DS around isn't nearly as nice).

So I'm not going to buy the DS version. I'll just hold out hope that, after the 360/PS3 version, they'll start working on the Wii version again. If it's made, you've got a guaranteed sale here.

[Bulldog_PS3]

I was very disappointed to hear that there might not be a Wii version; though I own a DS, I like playing multiplayer games with people beside me, and most of my friends don't have a DS; my boyfriend and I share our DS so we can't play with each other (even if we could, passing the DS around isn't nearly as nice).

So I'm not going to buy the DS version. I'll just hold out hope that, after the 360/PS3 version, they'll start working on the Wii version again. If it's made, you've got a guaranteed sale here.

You will be able to play online with the DS version, using wi-fi. I plan on getting the PS3 version for me and the DS version for my wife.

[RobC]

That's really disappointing...I was going to buy CivRev as soon as it came out for the Wii and now it's a real let down after all the build up... :(

[treyson007]

IGN.com is reporting that the Wii, despite now having the largest installed user base, is getting shafted by Firaxis. Civilization Revolution development on the Wii has been halted. Why? No answer. I was really looking forward to this game, and I'm quite irritated now.

What's the problem here?

Who else is upset by this news?

I saw a video with sid and he said that it will come out for wii in fall so u don't need to worry;)

[fortunzfavor]

I'd blame Nintendo :p

But seriously. They said people don't want HD but I saw a recent article where they found 65% of Wii owners have a HD (66% of 360 owners and something like 75% of PS3 owners). Damn shame the Wii isn't in HD, it'd kick much more ass that way...
The real issue here is horsepower, not display options. If the Wii were powerful enough but were still chugging out analog output, whatever engine firaxis is using would probably still be fairly easy to convert to Wii.

As to HD, another survery showed less than half of 360 and PS3 owners were even aware of their consoles HD abilities. Just because a certain number of Wii owners have an HDTV doesn't mean they'd really be willing to pay to have the Wii made HD compatible (720p or higher). A $250 price point moves a lot of consoles.

So I'm not saying don't blame Nintendo, I'm just saying blame them for the horsepower, not the HD. If they could display their present games in 720p, it wouldn't make Civ Rev any easier to port over.

[fortunzfavor]

I saw a video with sid and he said that it will come out for wii in fall so u don't need to worry;)

What might the date of that video be? You have read the thread, right?

[treyson007]

What might the date of that video be? You have read the thread, right?

I can't remember wat link it was but its on youtube.

[treyson007]

that stinks i guess they realy are not putting it on the wii at least i also have a 360.

[2K Dawn]

I saw a video with sid and he said that it will come out for wii in fall so u don't need to worry;)

That video is likely old, unfortunately. While Civ Rev was being developed for the Wii that has since been discontinued due to resources at Firaxis, as Jason mentioned in this thread.

[copiano-axe]

Ever since i started gaming on my PC I felt unsatisfied with some of the overall gameplay available to gamers. A lot of games were just point and shoot, not many stratigic games, that allowed you to play (and win) in numerous ways. This all ended a few years ago when i first played CIV 3.
Immediatly I knew I had found the OMEGA-OMNI-SERIES of all time. I religiously played CIV 3 every moment i could and spent countless hours replaying saved (and already finished) games to see how my outcome could have changed over from time to time. The only thing was that I isolated myself away from my family every free moment, so when i heard Civ 4 was coming out with same PC multiplayer, I fell into a joyous cry :D . I loved Civ 4 and soon found that the "one more turn" slogan was no joke. With the Multiplayer, I spent more time with my family, and as well, crushed them under the power of my Roman Empire. Soon though, I left the computer world and moved into console games. I quickly found refuge in nintendo's vast universe, and thus found the wii. I saved money and bought myself a wii and many of it's accessories, but nothing seemed to satisfy the hole the Civ series filled. Then, one day, i was reading about Sid's Alpha-Centaury game (Which i am planning on buying, although would rock on ANY console), when i stumbled into the Civ-Revolution site (when it was just a page with the video on it) and The IGN article about the various consoles CivRev would be on. :eek: I was amazed, finally my favourite game would be coming to my favourite (and only) Console! I constantly checked back on the page until it reached were it is today. And so, A while back, when I found the wii version was on indefinate hold because of lack of man power, I promised myself to write this "post" on these forums someday.
That day is today (i guess you all already could have guessed that).....
So i ask the team at Firaxis and on the whole project, I understand the manpower is not available at the time so the game in on hold, but PLEASE do think this over in the future if you are contemplating on canceling the Wii version of Civilization Revolution. Thank-you for your time.

PS: Is there ANY chance that the "Pirates" series will be on the big consoles? :confused:

[Jason2K]

So i ask the team at Firaxis and on the whole project, I understand the manpower is not available at the time so the game in on hold, but PLEASE do think this over in the future if you are contemplating on canceling the Wii version of Civilization Revolution. Thank-you for your time.

Ultimately, the decision isn't ours to make. If the other versions sell really well, then hopefully CivRev will come to Wii at some point. All I can tell you is to tell everyone you know with a DS/360/PS3 to pick up a copy. :)

PS: Is there ANY chance that the "Pirates" series will be on the big consoles? :confused:

Pirates for Xbox is available now (now!) for download over the Xbox Live marketplace. It's awesome. :)

[idustin3]

2K has lost a big fan :mad:. in fact i signed up just to show how pissed of i am. i am a big fan of the civi series and all i am able to afford is a wii. lack of manpower my --- if you ask me i'd say there waisting time and money putting revolution on the ds. i own a ds and i am a fan of the ds games. What i see here is similer to what ea did with call of duty 4. instead of making it for the wii, the odvious winner of this generation console war, they put it on the ds. the way i see it the ds was made for lower class puzzle games and mediocre strategy games. if 2K is calling civi revolution a mediocre game they will soon relize they have made a mistake!!! the ds version looks sucky! ever since november 2006 the wii has done nothing but outslod the xbox 360 and ps3. 2K is making the biggest mistake of the companies history!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad::mad::mad:

[Breezy]

:confused: calm down dude i remember reading some were that civ rev would be coming out for the wii fall 2008

[Breezy]

2K has lost a big fan :mad:. in fact i signed up just to show how pissed of i am. i am a big fan of the civi series and all i am able to afford is a wii. lack of manpower my --- if you ask me i'd say there waisting time and money putting revolution on the ds. i own a ds and i am a fan of the ds games. What i see here is similer to what ea did with call of duty 4. instead of making it for the wii, the odvious winner of this generation console war, they put it on the ds. the way i see it the ds was made for lower class puzzle games and mediocre strategy games. if 2K is calling civi revolution a mediocre game they will soon relize they have made a mistake!!! the ds version looks sucky! ever since november 2006 the wii has done nothing but outslod the xbox 360 and ps3. 2K is making the biggest mistake of the companies history!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad::mad::mad:


=O you do know that civ rev will be coming out for the wii fall right

[Boogiums]

I got CIV coming to me on the 360. I went as far as to boycott all Nintendo products this generation, they had ticked me off for the last couple of generations in there try to catch up strategy to Sony and Microsoft, so hearing that Wii was going to lose out, it didn't bother me a bit. But after listening to the Pod casts and seeing screen shots, I thought to myself once I'm on the road how will I get my CIV fix.... So I went out and bought a DS, gave in on my Boycott to Nintendo just for CIV. Oh well at least my principals held out for a great game.

[Styvesant]

IGN.com is reporting that the Wii, despite now having the largest installed user base, is getting shafted by Firaxis. Civilization Revolution development on the Wii has been halted. Why? No answer. I was really looking forward to this game, and I'm quite irritated now.

What's the problem here?

Who else is upset by this news?
I can understand why people are upset to not have this come out on Wii. It looks fantastic for a Civ game :)

[ATC 1982]

I think all consoles should at least have a CIV Game. If it ain't this I hope it is another one.

[hero33]

i hope firaxis isn't naive enough to waste time and money on a dead in the water backward system like the wii. heres to hoping they drop the ds too... and this is comming from a ds/wii owner.

the 360 and ps3 have SO much more to offer players and developers then a cheap novelty system with a bad control method and shoddy graphics. lets face it, the wii is a novelty and web browser at best.

[copiano-axe]

the 360 and ps3 have SO much more to offer players and developers then a cheap novelty system with a bad control method and shoddy graphics....

The wii's graphics can be better, but no game has been published that takes full advantage of the system, look it up. Nintendo is taking its time releasing good games, unlike other consoles that have flushed their games-series as soon as the console came out. I really am hoping for the wii's CivRev, but if it does not come out, then i'll have to settle for another great game, Will Wright's "spore" :)

Here's a link to show off the wii's graphics (scrooll down on article):

http://au.wii.ign.com/articles/867/867498p1.html

Watch the video at the bottom of the link...

[Thrallia]

i hope firaxis isn't naive enough to waste time and money on a dead in the water backward system like the wii. heres to hoping they drop the ds too... and this is comming from a ds/wii owner.

the 360 and ps3 have SO much more to offer players and developers then a cheap novelty system with a bad control method and shoddy graphics. lets face it, the wii is a novelty and web browser at best.

right...the PS3 has nothing to offer people except a cheap Blu-Ray player.

The Wii offers enjoyment and fun for the whole family. I've had my parents, my parents-in-laws, my siblings, and my siblings-in-laws all over to my house since I got my Wii on launch day, and every one of them has now bought a Wii of their own.

It may not have 'HD' but when using a Component Cable with it, it looks pretty darn close on the better made games(especially with the art design and direction these games take). Its certainly capable of much better graphics than the majority of games on it have had. Heck, the Gamecube and Xbox were capable of better graphics than most of the Wii games out there...but just remember the graphics the best Gamecube and Xbox games had...and imagine them about 3-4x better, and you'll see what the Wii is capable of. The gamecube was the most powerful of the systems last generation, and it took until 2005 for anyone to take full advantage of its abilities. Don't give up on the Wii just yet...there's plenty of great games to come, and that's even before the 3rd party companies figure out how to make good games for it.

Sure, I've got 3x more games on the 360 than I do for the Wii, but I play the Wii just as often because the games I've got for it are of just as fun.

I agree that from an install base perspective, it makes no sense to put it on the PS3 rather than the Wii...but graphics are the most time consuming part of a video game, so I can understand how they would put the Wii version on hold for awhile.

As for those clamouring for a PSP version...I'd just give up and get a DS, if I were you...the PSP isn't good for anything but mediocre PS2 ports(or for introducing what will become a PS2 port)

I'd like to know what games you were playing on the Wii that made you decide it had a shoddy control scheme...I'd be willing to bet you were playing some of the bad ports or the movie games. There's plenty of Wii games that have great, intuitive control schemes.

[Joneleth]

I understand people are upset over this, I would be too if the console I owned wasn't getting Civ Revolutions. But I also understand resource management... The developers have to make tough decisions for the greater good of the product itself. I only hope they get a chance to go back and give Wii owners the same great game the rest of us are going to get.

[fortunzfavor]

=O you do know that civ rev will be coming out for the wii fall right

Wrong. You did read the thread, right?

[hero33]

I'd like to know what games you were playing on the Wii that made you decide it had a shoddy control scheme...I'd be willing to bet you were playing some of the bad ports or the movie games. There's plenty of Wii games that have great, intuitive control schemes.

im a GAMER. i play EVERY game for EVERY system.

and my conclusion is that nintendo has fallen off their high horse, but somehow got their coat stuck in the stirrups and are now being dragged around in the mud.

im sorry if you disagree, but the control method is awfully clumsy, and you wont be seeing any consoles by any manufacturer attempt to do it in the future, because of what a flop it has been. and i have a FIFTY inch screen, i have plenty of room to be "accurate" with the damn wiimote... it just sucks sucks sucks


oh, and i've used the bluray feature of my ps3 (and enjoyed it) more then anything the wii could do, pile on top of that the ps3's obvious graphical dominance, mgs4 beta which hasn't left the drive, soon to come little big planet, and never to come HOME, and my wii will have a solid 2 inch layer of dust on it! i guess what i mean, is that in my book, the wii is as failboat vs ps3/360 as the DS is vs the psp.

[Thrallia]

lol wow...so I guess you think the DS is a fad also?

I just don't understand how you could feel Mario Galaxy, No More Heroes, Smash Brothers, Mario Kart, Twilight Princess, Metroid Prime 3, Paper Mario, Resident Evil 4 and Mario Party are shoddy.

There are certainly plenty of games on it that are shoddy...mainly ports that the developers were too lazy to do any decent work on(Fantastic Four, Open Season, and Transformers come to mind), but there's also a number of gems on it.

I guess you would also disagree that CivRev would have been a natural fit on the Wii, thanks to its near mouse-precision when the Wiimote is utilized properly.

[hero33]

lol wow...so I guess you think the DS is a fad also?

I just don't understand how you could feel Mario Galaxy, No More Heroes, Smash Brothers, Mario Kart, Twilight Princess, Metroid Prime 3, Paper Mario, Resident Evil 4 and Mario Party are shoddy.

There are certainly plenty of games on it that are shoddy...mainly ports that the developers were too lazy to do any decent work on(Fantastic Four, Open Season, and Transformers come to mind), but there's also a number of gems on it.

I guess you would also disagree that CivRev would have been a natural fit on the Wii, thanks to its near mouse-precision when the Wiimote is utilized properly.

mario galaxy and smash bros are two games i regularly play on the wii. you're not getting my point.

they would be BETTER with a TRADITIONAL control scheme. in fact, my 4 wiimotes are sitting on the ground, out of reach, and my 4 wifi gamecube controllers are sitting on the coffee table, for SSBB.

and the DS is crappy too (again, IMO); my psp gets infinite more playtime.

[fortunzfavor]

For all Nintendo's mistakes, the Wiimote wasn't one of them. The game library needs work, especially on the FPS side, and the strategy genre could definitely use some real entries (I'm looking at you Firaxis). I'm mainly a PC gamer, and this console brings a lot to the table for people like me.

Get over thinking your experience with the Wiimote is universal. I'll never play Civilization on a gamepad, and I sure as heck will never play an RTS like CnC on one. I'm not as insistent on not playing FPSs on a gamepad again, but the experience will never feel as good after playing the poorly made yet fantastically controlled MoHH2. Put a real FPS on the system with the same controls, and I'd never go back.

:)