Mongol GOTW - 2/8/09

[Think_Before_You_Speak]

First the map info. The Soc is located right above your start location on the same land mass. The Scog is somewhere near the Germans I imagine. The Aw is above the French on a small island. Atlantis?? The Egyptians are roughly north west of the Aw on their own island. The Germans are beneath the French and and the Zulu are beneath the Germans to the south east.

There are no walk ins. Yet getting France early is still possible.

My internet connection kept cutting out just as I was about to finish a game - no joke and very Frustrating, as I had one perfect run which I couldn't replicate. It cut out as I was about to have a 1100BC dom win. I tried again and was a turn slower and my internet cut out again as I walked into Thebes.... I eventually registered a 900BC dom win. I know that 1200BC is possible with some tweaking as I should have had a 1100BC win. Only relic I got was the Aw.

I will try for a tech win, my aim will be 750AD and to improve on that. Well if my Internet allows it without cutting out.

[Zso_Zso]

7 cities is SW of the Germans on a fairly big island, can be reached with galley.
Atlantis is East-North-East of the Zulu quite deep in the middle of the ocean (you can't even see it with a galley). I did a 1275AD tech win but I made several key mistakes and wasted a lot of turns, also overdone the research, had 1600 beakers/turn and researched all pre-req of space flight when I could have GSd it several turn earlier (I forgot I had 2 GS saved up from early on) and I wasted a lot of gold on rushing Universities which was not necessary at all and I blow lots of gold, so did not have enough to rush the parts when I got SF. So, below 1000AD should be no problem.

[Think_Before_You_Speak]

Well my estimate was dead on, lol. With my very first attempt at the tech win I got 750AD spaceship arrival.

This was funny because I neither got the Scog or the Soc, I didn't even have the East India company until 0AD. Although I did have 25 cities by 0AD which is good for Mongol in my op. By the end I had about 30 cities. There was room for many more but there really was no need for them. I also forgot to get atlantis, only picking it up after the world was revealed from spaceflight.

I think if I had a perfect game which would include getting an early gb and nabbing Atlantis early, I could potentially get a 550AD tech win with the Mongols, but that would be the best possible in my opinion, and you would need atleast 3 gs to go with that. However getting 6k to 7k gold by such an early timeframe would be the only difficult part for the Mongols.

[Think_Before_You_Speak]

Well I've yet again failed at 1200BC. I must have given the Dom win 10 attempts by now. Anyhow it should have happened but the Egyptian archer army 27 def killed my legion army 22 att without even a wound. My next legion army wounded it. However the archers then got lucky vs my 3rd legion army. I am stuck with a 1100BC dom win. However seed does not seem to be that important this week as I can do whatever I want and always get atleat a 900BC dom win. My upgrades are never or very rarely right, but it still works out.

If I had the right upgrades at the right time, I could easily get a 1200BC or maybe even a 1300BC dom win.

Not many xbox players seem to be bothering with the Mongol Gotw. I would be interested in knowing what the Dom and tech win scores are on Xbox?

[Grayson]

I think as of right now, it's just 450AD on xbox, none of the serious players have done Deity yet.

[generic_toaster]

Well being a "serious" gotw'er :) I just put up a 1100bc win. Definitely could have been quicker.

I incorperated the SoC into my strat, waiting for a gs (also got a ga and sold him, ga's are so useless in gotw) I used the gs for math (around 2200), after getting pottery from the french and researching alpha and masonry myself. Going into another era was rough as gold was scarce. I used cats for egypt and horses for the rest.

I'm thinking that cats might have been over kill and maybe legions are better. But cats sure were fun.

EDIT: I just thought of it! Finally pottery from the french was useful! :D

[Think_Before_You_Speak]

Well we have very different strats then. If I spent enough time tweaking it I know I could get a 1200BC, maybe 1300BC win using my method.

I take Paris at 2700BC. I take Germany between 2100BC and 1900BC. If you leave it until 1900BC you get 190 gold compared to 130 at 2100BC. I let them get the scog in my game as you could guess. I take the Zulu out at 1600BC. the problem is Egypt getting lucky. So the quickest I can take them out is by 1200BC giving me the 1100BC Dom win.

I'm better at tech wins in general. However I have only given that 1 attempt whilst I've given the Dom win atleast a dozen.

[edisoncarter]

Got my first GOTW dom win -- 150AD on deity, xbox. Maybe if I had continued straight from the Germans to Zulu I could have caught them on a walkout, but delayed and built up 6 horse armies. Egypt is one tough customer in 0AD I can tell you. They wiped out one or two of my armies when I landed because I only brought a single archer instead of an archer army.

[generic_toaster]

@edisoncarter - nice going! Good to see someone new.

Gave it another go and shaved off a turn, so 1200bc now. My cat strat will top out at 1300bc, but it'll take some work...

I also gave legions a try, but lost to the zulu. 1st 22.5v27 only damaging 1, then lost again 18v18. I finished off egypt anyway and see that this could yeild 1400bc, but i'm not in the mood to play anymore and will see how the scores go. And Think_Before_You_Speak is right, the promotions suck! Infil is the only useful one I got, the rest were march, geurilla and medic...really useful when you're dropping off you armies right next to a cap.

I think I stumbled across a set of moves that causes egypt to, well go retarded. Cuz when I get there they haven't formed an archer army and have an odd assortment of units: 1 legion army, 1 legion, 2 archers and a horseman?

[Think_Before_You_Speak]

I've stopped playing it now but yes I also came cross that set of moves whereby Egypt had not formed an archer army. I took them out at 1400BC, however that did not matter as my infiltration legion army lost 18 vs the Zulu archer army 15 defence, on the turn previous.

The Zulu move out their archer army at roughly 1800BC. You can get there beforehand and could attack when there is only one archer in their cap, however I did't have blitz..... only infiltration and march. So they move their archer army back in preventing you getting the cap with your hurt legion army.

So you wait for them to move the army back in and then kill it, their cap is empty and strangely they do not move their single archer back in. The odds are 18 vs 15 in your favour, you usually win, however sometimes you don't.

Btw, someone on PS3 has a 1500BC dom win last time I checked, it may have changed. But he must be using a very different strat as mine would definitley top out at 1400BC unless I could get very lucky with battle odds.

[generic_toaster]

Man where's all the regular gotw'ers??

Alright, I did my "normal" OCD approach...and got 1600bc. No cats, no SoC.

Took France at 3000bc - got IW
Germany at 2200bc
Zulu 1900bc on a walkout
Egypt was still a tough nut to crack...

[Magistratas]

I must be doing something absolutetly wrong. No matter what, I get obliterated by France. It seems that I tried every logical way, but I guess my logic got lost in the jungle.

How do you take France? :)

[generic_toaster]

I must be doing something absolutetly wrong. No matter what, I get obliterated by France. It seems that I tried every logical way, but I guess my logic got lost in the jungle.

How do you take France? :)

Yeah, I've been playing gotw, tweaking the seed is becoming second nature...

I'll give you almost everything...

I settle in 3500bc racking up 45g on the way. Rush 4 warriors. Send an army to the hill by france. Use the 4th warrior to attack a barb to tweak the seed, before attacking france. Attack france, heal, attack france again gaining blitz and take france 3000bc.

Getting blitz was tough, as the game wants to give you medic/geurilla. The trick was getting a barb to "reveal" itself...that annoying message they send. Do that and you should be offered blitz/infil instead.

wait, i think that's everything...oh well. let me know if you need more tips.

[edisoncarter]

I tried and tried to tweak the RNG to rush France with warriors like that. Your warrior army can also win the first two attacks if the 2nd warrior attacks the barb once. Finally gave up and researched HBR. The first rushed horseman fights his way through a barb to get veteran, join up into an army, then attack heal attack attack France. There's time to get him and a 2nd horse army to take Germany in 2100bc. I didn't think they walked out until 2100bc so I wasn't trying for 2200bc. On my game, they didn't get the 200g until 2100bc. I'd still like to see if I can catch Zulu in time for their walkout. Maybe take the barb near them and build a road. On my last try, I sent too much to Egypt and not enough to Zulu, took Egypt in 1500bc but failed against the Zulu with two horsemen armies.

How soon Germany gets the 200g artifact seems to depend on how soon you take the barb village to their northeast. Your presence convinces them to go the other way and take to the sea. If you don't take it, they don't get the artifact and instead settle a city next to the Zulu, which the Zulu then take.

[generic_toaster]

I tried and tried to tweak the RNG to rush France with warriors like that. Your warrior army can also win the first two attacks if the 2nd warrior attacks the barb once. Finally gave up and researched HBR. The first rushed horseman fights his way through a barb to get veteran, join up into an army, then attack heal attack attack France. There's time to get him and a 2nd horse army to take Germany in 2100bc. I didn't think they walked out until 2100bc so I wasn't trying for 2200bc. On my game, they didn't get the 200g until 2100bc. I'd still like to see if I can catch Zulu in time for their walkout. Maybe take the barb near them and build a road. On my last try, I sent too much to Egypt and not enough to Zulu, took Egypt in 1500bc but failed against the Zulu with two horsemen armies.

How soon Germany gets the 200g artifact seems to depend on how soon you take the barb village to their northeast. Your presence convinces them to go the other way and take to the sea. If you don't take it, they don't get the artifact and instead settle a city next to the Zulu, which the Zulu then take.

My only guess is that you're not gaining the blitz upgrade...your first attack vs france should occur at 3200 getting damaged once. Also on this turn you should pop the goodie hut getting a caravan, send it west towards the barb until you get the "message from the barbarians" (i think putting it on the hill triggers this). Heal for 3100 and attack again 3000.

perhaps you're also settling is a different place. I settle inland NE of the barb that's W of france. Send the militia after the discovery gold and goodie hut.

Hope that helps.

[Magistratas]

My only guess is that you're not gaining the blitz upgrade...your first attack vs france should occur at 3200 getting damaged once. Also on this turn you should pop the goodie hut getting a caravan, send it west towards the barb until you get the "message from the barbarians" (i think putting it on the hill triggers this). Heal for 3100 and attack again 3000.

perhaps you're also settling is a different place. I settle inland NE of the barb that's W of france. Send the militia after the discovery gold and goodie hut.

Hope that helps.

I've been doing this from the start, but my army still gets killed. Maybe it matters when and who meets French first? Do you settle on a hill in 3500, immediately rush a warrior and send him to France, who then asks for a peace (yeah right) in the same year? This is lunacy :)

[generic_toaster]

I've been doing this from the start, but my army still gets killed. Maybe it matters when and who meets French first? Do you settle on a hill in 3500, immediately rush a warrior and send him to France, who then asks for a peace (yeah right) in the same year? This is lunacy :)

Yeah, i used to feel like that when i first started playing and RickWJ would come up with these scores like it was nothing...

Alright, I'm at work but lets see how much I pull out of the ole noggin...

settler moves
4000 - NE, E
3900 - E, E
3800 - NE (hut), E (disco bonus)
3700 - E, SE
3600 - SE? (disco bonus), E
3500 - SE settle (should be NE of barb and get militia) set to all prod. Rush warrior, leave in cap. move militia NE - meet france - peace
3400 - rush warrior, one stays in cap, one moves NE. militia moves N
3300 - rush 3rd warrior form army and move onto hill next to paris. militia goes N? (disco bonus)
3200 - militia grabs goodie hut, get caravan. Send caravan W? to hill and get "message from barbarians" and sell. Rush warrior attack barb. Attack france winning getting 1 damage.
3100 - do whatever with militia. warrior stays in cap. heal army.
3000 - attack france, taking 2 damage win gaining blitz and take france.

I put ? next to moves i'm not sure about and i'll check it when i get home.

EDIT: Just got home and confirmed it.

[generic_toaster]

Have been messing around with the settling on the hill and made that one work too.

3500: rush warrior and chill. militia S
3400: rush warrior, one chills other NE meet france peace. militia S disco bonus
3300: rush warrior, form army and move onto hill. militia grabs hut, get caravan and sell. DO NOT MOVE caravan
3200: rush warrior attack barbs. attack france get 1 damage. militia S
3100: heal army. warrior chills. militia moves S meet zulu
3000: attack france, get blitz take france and get IW

as far as I got, have no idea if it's better than my original set of moves...

[Hellogoodbye123]

There are no walk ins. Yet getting France early is still possible.

France? is in this Gotw????

why is france in all of these??? and apparently really easy to capture???

[generic_toaster]

France? is in this Gotw????

why is france in all of these??? and apparently really easy to capture???

Isn't the french motto: We surrender :D

EDIT: for any french people, I'm just kidding...

[Magistratas]

Man... All this time my only difference was not attacking the barb with the fourth warrior. Aggravating. Thanks for the tip!

[Random Fires]

Man where's all the regular gotw'ers??


Well, I'm in the middle of a move leaving only sunday as a play day. And next sunday the last for a while.

Nice 1600bc a good score. It's always amusing to see the difference in strategies from level to level. Nice score.

Bye fer a while...

[edisoncarter]

Yeah, I never would have got the step of getting introduced to the barb to change the elite upgrade. That's what I was missing with warrior, although horse rush was working pretty well anyway.

It's hard to imagine how it would be possible to do any better than 1600BC. 1700BC would only be 5 turns after Germany if you managed to take them in 2200BC. It takes 2 turns to move the boat to Egypt and unload, and 1 turn to hold the capital after the battle assuming you win in one turn. You'd only have 3 turns to spend the money from Germany and get the stuff on the boat.

[generic_toaster]

Yeah, I never would have got the step of getting introduced to the barb to change the elite upgrade. That's what I was missing with warrior, although horse rush was working pretty well anyway.

It's hard to imagine how it would be possible to do any better than 1600BC. 1700BC would only be 5 turns after Germany if you managed to take them in 2200BC. It takes 2 turns to move the boat to Egypt and unload, and 1 turn to hold the capital after the battle assuming you win in one turn. You'd only have 3 turns to spend the money from Germany and get the stuff on the boat.

In fact some on xbox has 1800bc...I think I see how to do it, but getting the stars to align is rough. And in fact, you need to take germany in 2200, right after they get the 7 cities and spend all the money that turn to have a galley loaded up and on its way to egypt. One of the tricks for egypt is to put a lone militia on a square, the ai will kill it and rid you of one unit to kill on the next turn.

[generic_toaster]

Got the 1800 win, which gets me 2nd. But man was it tough! And u have to have that galley loaded and sent to Egypt on 2100, then take them in one turn.